Could an astronaut manually land a reentry vessel in a specific location without any help from ground control...











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So, let's say an astronaut has crashed his shuttle into earth only to find that there are no cities or any signs of human-made objects left on earth.



Another astronaut is orbiting earth in her space station, much like the ISS.



The only 2 human made objects left in the planet/universe are his ship and her space station (no cities, no satellites, no radio towers etc.) he is able to communicate with her through the radio gear on his shuttle every time she passes over him in orbit.



How could she manually land her reentry capsule at or near his location (without any satellites, ground control, etc.)? My idea is that they use the stars, sun, moon, and large landmasses to give her an idea of his coordinates and she manually steers her reentry capsule to meet him on earth. I am not sure if this is too far fetched or if it would be somewhat feasible for a sci fi story.



(Note that I am using fictional shuttles and technology that i am willing to make somewhat more advanced than current technology if necessary)



Thanks for the help!










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  • The Space Shuttles were decommissioned 7 years ago. Is that the shuttle you're referring to, or "near future" vehicles?
    – RonJohn
    4 hours ago










  • You might want to ask this on space.stackexchange.com, since it may very well be something that people have considered in real life
    – divibisan
    4 hours ago










  • The answers will have to vary massively based on your reentry vessel's capabilities. An apollo like craft is going to have to deal with the fact that, at 8km/s, a 1 second delay in your responses is enough to get you 8km off target. Switch to a space shuttle, which has aero properties (albeit those of a brick!), and you may be able to do corrections mid flight and get closer.
    – Cort Ammon
    1 hour ago















up vote
5
down vote

favorite












So, let's say an astronaut has crashed his shuttle into earth only to find that there are no cities or any signs of human-made objects left on earth.



Another astronaut is orbiting earth in her space station, much like the ISS.



The only 2 human made objects left in the planet/universe are his ship and her space station (no cities, no satellites, no radio towers etc.) he is able to communicate with her through the radio gear on his shuttle every time she passes over him in orbit.



How could she manually land her reentry capsule at or near his location (without any satellites, ground control, etc.)? My idea is that they use the stars, sun, moon, and large landmasses to give her an idea of his coordinates and she manually steers her reentry capsule to meet him on earth. I am not sure if this is too far fetched or if it would be somewhat feasible for a sci fi story.



(Note that I am using fictional shuttles and technology that i am willing to make somewhat more advanced than current technology if necessary)



Thanks for the help!










share|improve this question






















  • The Space Shuttles were decommissioned 7 years ago. Is that the shuttle you're referring to, or "near future" vehicles?
    – RonJohn
    4 hours ago










  • You might want to ask this on space.stackexchange.com, since it may very well be something that people have considered in real life
    – divibisan
    4 hours ago










  • The answers will have to vary massively based on your reentry vessel's capabilities. An apollo like craft is going to have to deal with the fact that, at 8km/s, a 1 second delay in your responses is enough to get you 8km off target. Switch to a space shuttle, which has aero properties (albeit those of a brick!), and you may be able to do corrections mid flight and get closer.
    – Cort Ammon
    1 hour ago













up vote
5
down vote

favorite









up vote
5
down vote

favorite











So, let's say an astronaut has crashed his shuttle into earth only to find that there are no cities or any signs of human-made objects left on earth.



Another astronaut is orbiting earth in her space station, much like the ISS.



The only 2 human made objects left in the planet/universe are his ship and her space station (no cities, no satellites, no radio towers etc.) he is able to communicate with her through the radio gear on his shuttle every time she passes over him in orbit.



How could she manually land her reentry capsule at or near his location (without any satellites, ground control, etc.)? My idea is that they use the stars, sun, moon, and large landmasses to give her an idea of his coordinates and she manually steers her reentry capsule to meet him on earth. I am not sure if this is too far fetched or if it would be somewhat feasible for a sci fi story.



(Note that I am using fictional shuttles and technology that i am willing to make somewhat more advanced than current technology if necessary)



Thanks for the help!










share|improve this question













So, let's say an astronaut has crashed his shuttle into earth only to find that there are no cities or any signs of human-made objects left on earth.



Another astronaut is orbiting earth in her space station, much like the ISS.



The only 2 human made objects left in the planet/universe are his ship and her space station (no cities, no satellites, no radio towers etc.) he is able to communicate with her through the radio gear on his shuttle every time she passes over him in orbit.



How could she manually land her reentry capsule at or near his location (without any satellites, ground control, etc.)? My idea is that they use the stars, sun, moon, and large landmasses to give her an idea of his coordinates and she manually steers her reentry capsule to meet him on earth. I am not sure if this is too far fetched or if it would be somewhat feasible for a sci fi story.



(Note that I am using fictional shuttles and technology that i am willing to make somewhat more advanced than current technology if necessary)



Thanks for the help!







science-fiction space travel






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share|improve this question











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share|improve this question










asked 5 hours ago









Jon James

1294




1294












  • The Space Shuttles were decommissioned 7 years ago. Is that the shuttle you're referring to, or "near future" vehicles?
    – RonJohn
    4 hours ago










  • You might want to ask this on space.stackexchange.com, since it may very well be something that people have considered in real life
    – divibisan
    4 hours ago










  • The answers will have to vary massively based on your reentry vessel's capabilities. An apollo like craft is going to have to deal with the fact that, at 8km/s, a 1 second delay in your responses is enough to get you 8km off target. Switch to a space shuttle, which has aero properties (albeit those of a brick!), and you may be able to do corrections mid flight and get closer.
    – Cort Ammon
    1 hour ago


















  • The Space Shuttles were decommissioned 7 years ago. Is that the shuttle you're referring to, or "near future" vehicles?
    – RonJohn
    4 hours ago










  • You might want to ask this on space.stackexchange.com, since it may very well be something that people have considered in real life
    – divibisan
    4 hours ago










  • The answers will have to vary massively based on your reentry vessel's capabilities. An apollo like craft is going to have to deal with the fact that, at 8km/s, a 1 second delay in your responses is enough to get you 8km off target. Switch to a space shuttle, which has aero properties (albeit those of a brick!), and you may be able to do corrections mid flight and get closer.
    – Cort Ammon
    1 hour ago
















The Space Shuttles were decommissioned 7 years ago. Is that the shuttle you're referring to, or "near future" vehicles?
– RonJohn
4 hours ago




The Space Shuttles were decommissioned 7 years ago. Is that the shuttle you're referring to, or "near future" vehicles?
– RonJohn
4 hours ago












You might want to ask this on space.stackexchange.com, since it may very well be something that people have considered in real life
– divibisan
4 hours ago




You might want to ask this on space.stackexchange.com, since it may very well be something that people have considered in real life
– divibisan
4 hours ago












The answers will have to vary massively based on your reentry vessel's capabilities. An apollo like craft is going to have to deal with the fact that, at 8km/s, a 1 second delay in your responses is enough to get you 8km off target. Switch to a space shuttle, which has aero properties (albeit those of a brick!), and you may be able to do corrections mid flight and get closer.
– Cort Ammon
1 hour ago




The answers will have to vary massively based on your reentry vessel's capabilities. An apollo like craft is going to have to deal with the fact that, at 8km/s, a 1 second delay in your responses is enough to get you 8km off target. Switch to a space shuttle, which has aero properties (albeit those of a brick!), and you may be able to do corrections mid flight and get closer.
– Cort Ammon
1 hour ago










2 Answers
2






active

oldest

votes

















up vote
4
down vote













Probably yes, within reasonable distance.



Any space-to-surface craft would be designed with a communications failure in mind and carry instruments like sextants and chronometers. With those, a trained aviator should be able to make precise orbit corrections and a reentry burn. Even if there is no ephemeris in the spacecraft, the astronaut should be able to fix the orbit relative to some stars and then plot the ground site from differences in radio reception quality. The latter would be quite inaccurate, of course.



The problem happens after the spacecraft enters the atmosphere. There would be no weather reports and the spacecraft will have little maneuvering capability. Small differences in atmospheric conditions could carry the spacecraft dozens or hundreds of miles off course.



In addition to this error there would be any mistake in the astronaut's calculation of the intended landing site.



Things to consider:




  • Without light pollution the astronaut on the surface might be able to see the spacecraft, and tell exactly when it passes the horizon. A few sightings and a little math should give the exact position on the ground.

  • A shuttle is not designed to land on rough fields. The choice might be between a crash on the ground or a water landing and sinking. An Apollo capsule was designed to land in the water, but supposedly survivable for a ground landing.

  • Water landings could be a bad idea if there is no rescue boat coming.






share|improve this answer























  • Even more accurate than visuals: your radio links would die when they fall below the horizon, and return on the other side.
    – Cort Ammon
    1 hour ago


















up vote
2
down vote













Yes and no



This is doable. If you play Kerbal Space Program long enough, you learn how to do it. I can land landers on Laythe, which is more than 90% covered by an ocean, from a low orbit by eye with just a small thruster and a parachute. An astronaut who has had enough reentries should be familiar with the paths from low orbit to ground.



However, KSP much like science, assumes ideal conditions. There is a problem on real Earth called weather. Wind will push your vessel this way and that, and may be highly unpredictable. Rockets that we launch to space can compensate for it once they are high enough into the atmosphere, or after they exit it. Your astronaut, though, may end up landing dozens of kilometers away from her target.






share|improve this answer























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    2 Answers
    2






    active

    oldest

    votes








    2 Answers
    2






    active

    oldest

    votes









    active

    oldest

    votes






    active

    oldest

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    up vote
    4
    down vote













    Probably yes, within reasonable distance.



    Any space-to-surface craft would be designed with a communications failure in mind and carry instruments like sextants and chronometers. With those, a trained aviator should be able to make precise orbit corrections and a reentry burn. Even if there is no ephemeris in the spacecraft, the astronaut should be able to fix the orbit relative to some stars and then plot the ground site from differences in radio reception quality. The latter would be quite inaccurate, of course.



    The problem happens after the spacecraft enters the atmosphere. There would be no weather reports and the spacecraft will have little maneuvering capability. Small differences in atmospheric conditions could carry the spacecraft dozens or hundreds of miles off course.



    In addition to this error there would be any mistake in the astronaut's calculation of the intended landing site.



    Things to consider:




    • Without light pollution the astronaut on the surface might be able to see the spacecraft, and tell exactly when it passes the horizon. A few sightings and a little math should give the exact position on the ground.

    • A shuttle is not designed to land on rough fields. The choice might be between a crash on the ground or a water landing and sinking. An Apollo capsule was designed to land in the water, but supposedly survivable for a ground landing.

    • Water landings could be a bad idea if there is no rescue boat coming.






    share|improve this answer























    • Even more accurate than visuals: your radio links would die when they fall below the horizon, and return on the other side.
      – Cort Ammon
      1 hour ago















    up vote
    4
    down vote













    Probably yes, within reasonable distance.



    Any space-to-surface craft would be designed with a communications failure in mind and carry instruments like sextants and chronometers. With those, a trained aviator should be able to make precise orbit corrections and a reentry burn. Even if there is no ephemeris in the spacecraft, the astronaut should be able to fix the orbit relative to some stars and then plot the ground site from differences in radio reception quality. The latter would be quite inaccurate, of course.



    The problem happens after the spacecraft enters the atmosphere. There would be no weather reports and the spacecraft will have little maneuvering capability. Small differences in atmospheric conditions could carry the spacecraft dozens or hundreds of miles off course.



    In addition to this error there would be any mistake in the astronaut's calculation of the intended landing site.



    Things to consider:




    • Without light pollution the astronaut on the surface might be able to see the spacecraft, and tell exactly when it passes the horizon. A few sightings and a little math should give the exact position on the ground.

    • A shuttle is not designed to land on rough fields. The choice might be between a crash on the ground or a water landing and sinking. An Apollo capsule was designed to land in the water, but supposedly survivable for a ground landing.

    • Water landings could be a bad idea if there is no rescue boat coming.






    share|improve this answer























    • Even more accurate than visuals: your radio links would die when they fall below the horizon, and return on the other side.
      – Cort Ammon
      1 hour ago













    up vote
    4
    down vote










    up vote
    4
    down vote









    Probably yes, within reasonable distance.



    Any space-to-surface craft would be designed with a communications failure in mind and carry instruments like sextants and chronometers. With those, a trained aviator should be able to make precise orbit corrections and a reentry burn. Even if there is no ephemeris in the spacecraft, the astronaut should be able to fix the orbit relative to some stars and then plot the ground site from differences in radio reception quality. The latter would be quite inaccurate, of course.



    The problem happens after the spacecraft enters the atmosphere. There would be no weather reports and the spacecraft will have little maneuvering capability. Small differences in atmospheric conditions could carry the spacecraft dozens or hundreds of miles off course.



    In addition to this error there would be any mistake in the astronaut's calculation of the intended landing site.



    Things to consider:




    • Without light pollution the astronaut on the surface might be able to see the spacecraft, and tell exactly when it passes the horizon. A few sightings and a little math should give the exact position on the ground.

    • A shuttle is not designed to land on rough fields. The choice might be between a crash on the ground or a water landing and sinking. An Apollo capsule was designed to land in the water, but supposedly survivable for a ground landing.

    • Water landings could be a bad idea if there is no rescue boat coming.






    share|improve this answer














    Probably yes, within reasonable distance.



    Any space-to-surface craft would be designed with a communications failure in mind and carry instruments like sextants and chronometers. With those, a trained aviator should be able to make precise orbit corrections and a reentry burn. Even if there is no ephemeris in the spacecraft, the astronaut should be able to fix the orbit relative to some stars and then plot the ground site from differences in radio reception quality. The latter would be quite inaccurate, of course.



    The problem happens after the spacecraft enters the atmosphere. There would be no weather reports and the spacecraft will have little maneuvering capability. Small differences in atmospheric conditions could carry the spacecraft dozens or hundreds of miles off course.



    In addition to this error there would be any mistake in the astronaut's calculation of the intended landing site.



    Things to consider:




    • Without light pollution the astronaut on the surface might be able to see the spacecraft, and tell exactly when it passes the horizon. A few sightings and a little math should give the exact position on the ground.

    • A shuttle is not designed to land on rough fields. The choice might be between a crash on the ground or a water landing and sinking. An Apollo capsule was designed to land in the water, but supposedly survivable for a ground landing.

    • Water landings could be a bad idea if there is no rescue boat coming.







    share|improve this answer














    share|improve this answer



    share|improve this answer








    edited 4 hours ago

























    answered 4 hours ago









    o.m.

    57.1k682190




    57.1k682190












    • Even more accurate than visuals: your radio links would die when they fall below the horizon, and return on the other side.
      – Cort Ammon
      1 hour ago


















    • Even more accurate than visuals: your radio links would die when they fall below the horizon, and return on the other side.
      – Cort Ammon
      1 hour ago
















    Even more accurate than visuals: your radio links would die when they fall below the horizon, and return on the other side.
    – Cort Ammon
    1 hour ago




    Even more accurate than visuals: your radio links would die when they fall below the horizon, and return on the other side.
    – Cort Ammon
    1 hour ago










    up vote
    2
    down vote













    Yes and no



    This is doable. If you play Kerbal Space Program long enough, you learn how to do it. I can land landers on Laythe, which is more than 90% covered by an ocean, from a low orbit by eye with just a small thruster and a parachute. An astronaut who has had enough reentries should be familiar with the paths from low orbit to ground.



    However, KSP much like science, assumes ideal conditions. There is a problem on real Earth called weather. Wind will push your vessel this way and that, and may be highly unpredictable. Rockets that we launch to space can compensate for it once they are high enough into the atmosphere, or after they exit it. Your astronaut, though, may end up landing dozens of kilometers away from her target.






    share|improve this answer



























      up vote
      2
      down vote













      Yes and no



      This is doable. If you play Kerbal Space Program long enough, you learn how to do it. I can land landers on Laythe, which is more than 90% covered by an ocean, from a low orbit by eye with just a small thruster and a parachute. An astronaut who has had enough reentries should be familiar with the paths from low orbit to ground.



      However, KSP much like science, assumes ideal conditions. There is a problem on real Earth called weather. Wind will push your vessel this way and that, and may be highly unpredictable. Rockets that we launch to space can compensate for it once they are high enough into the atmosphere, or after they exit it. Your astronaut, though, may end up landing dozens of kilometers away from her target.






      share|improve this answer

























        up vote
        2
        down vote










        up vote
        2
        down vote









        Yes and no



        This is doable. If you play Kerbal Space Program long enough, you learn how to do it. I can land landers on Laythe, which is more than 90% covered by an ocean, from a low orbit by eye with just a small thruster and a parachute. An astronaut who has had enough reentries should be familiar with the paths from low orbit to ground.



        However, KSP much like science, assumes ideal conditions. There is a problem on real Earth called weather. Wind will push your vessel this way and that, and may be highly unpredictable. Rockets that we launch to space can compensate for it once they are high enough into the atmosphere, or after they exit it. Your astronaut, though, may end up landing dozens of kilometers away from her target.






        share|improve this answer














        Yes and no



        This is doable. If you play Kerbal Space Program long enough, you learn how to do it. I can land landers on Laythe, which is more than 90% covered by an ocean, from a low orbit by eye with just a small thruster and a parachute. An astronaut who has had enough reentries should be familiar with the paths from low orbit to ground.



        However, KSP much like science, assumes ideal conditions. There is a problem on real Earth called weather. Wind will push your vessel this way and that, and may be highly unpredictable. Rockets that we launch to space can compensate for it once they are high enough into the atmosphere, or after they exit it. Your astronaut, though, may end up landing dozens of kilometers away from her target.







        share|improve this answer














        share|improve this answer



        share|improve this answer








        edited 2 hours ago

























        answered 2 hours ago









        Renan

        40.8k1194206




        40.8k1194206






























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