Show that if ${x_n}$ converge and ${y_n}$ diverge then ${ax_n + by_n}$ diverge, for $b ne 0$
$begingroup$
Let ${x_n}$ be a convergent sequence and ${y_n}$ a divergent sequence. Prove that ${ax_n + by_n}$ diverges for $bne 0$.
Intuitively this is obvious to me, however i want a formal proof.
Using the definition of a limit we know that:
$$
lim_{nto infty}ax_n = A stackrel{text{def}}{iff} {forall varepsilon > 0 exists N in mathbb N : forall n ge N implies |ax_n - A| < varepsilon}
$$
On the other hand we know that $y_n$ diverges, thus:
$$
lim_{n to infty}by_n = exists! stackrel{text{def}}{iff} {exists varepsilon >0 N in mathbb N : exists n ge N implies |by_n - B| ge varepsilon}
$$
Choose some $varepsilon$:
$$
begin{cases}
|ax_n - A| < {varepsilon over 2} \
|by_n - B| ge {varepsilon over 2}
end{cases}
$$
or:
$$
begin{cases}
|ax_n - A| < {varepsilon over 2} \
-|by_n - B| le -{varepsilon over 2}
end{cases}
$$
This is where I got stuck. It feels like i have to use some sort of triangular inequality (either direct or reverse) and find a contradiction. How do I proceed from this point?
calculus sequences-and-series limits convergence epsilon-delta
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Let ${x_n}$ be a convergent sequence and ${y_n}$ a divergent sequence. Prove that ${ax_n + by_n}$ diverges for $bne 0$.
Intuitively this is obvious to me, however i want a formal proof.
Using the definition of a limit we know that:
$$
lim_{nto infty}ax_n = A stackrel{text{def}}{iff} {forall varepsilon > 0 exists N in mathbb N : forall n ge N implies |ax_n - A| < varepsilon}
$$
On the other hand we know that $y_n$ diverges, thus:
$$
lim_{n to infty}by_n = exists! stackrel{text{def}}{iff} {exists varepsilon >0 N in mathbb N : exists n ge N implies |by_n - B| ge varepsilon}
$$
Choose some $varepsilon$:
$$
begin{cases}
|ax_n - A| < {varepsilon over 2} \
|by_n - B| ge {varepsilon over 2}
end{cases}
$$
or:
$$
begin{cases}
|ax_n - A| < {varepsilon over 2} \
-|by_n - B| le -{varepsilon over 2}
end{cases}
$$
This is where I got stuck. It feels like i have to use some sort of triangular inequality (either direct or reverse) and find a contradiction. How do I proceed from this point?
calculus sequences-and-series limits convergence epsilon-delta
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Let ${x_n}$ be a convergent sequence and ${y_n}$ a divergent sequence. Prove that ${ax_n + by_n}$ diverges for $bne 0$.
Intuitively this is obvious to me, however i want a formal proof.
Using the definition of a limit we know that:
$$
lim_{nto infty}ax_n = A stackrel{text{def}}{iff} {forall varepsilon > 0 exists N in mathbb N : forall n ge N implies |ax_n - A| < varepsilon}
$$
On the other hand we know that $y_n$ diverges, thus:
$$
lim_{n to infty}by_n = exists! stackrel{text{def}}{iff} {exists varepsilon >0 N in mathbb N : exists n ge N implies |by_n - B| ge varepsilon}
$$
Choose some $varepsilon$:
$$
begin{cases}
|ax_n - A| < {varepsilon over 2} \
|by_n - B| ge {varepsilon over 2}
end{cases}
$$
or:
$$
begin{cases}
|ax_n - A| < {varepsilon over 2} \
-|by_n - B| le -{varepsilon over 2}
end{cases}
$$
This is where I got stuck. It feels like i have to use some sort of triangular inequality (either direct or reverse) and find a contradiction. How do I proceed from this point?
calculus sequences-and-series limits convergence epsilon-delta
$endgroup$
Let ${x_n}$ be a convergent sequence and ${y_n}$ a divergent sequence. Prove that ${ax_n + by_n}$ diverges for $bne 0$.
Intuitively this is obvious to me, however i want a formal proof.
Using the definition of a limit we know that:
$$
lim_{nto infty}ax_n = A stackrel{text{def}}{iff} {forall varepsilon > 0 exists N in mathbb N : forall n ge N implies |ax_n - A| < varepsilon}
$$
On the other hand we know that $y_n$ diverges, thus:
$$
lim_{n to infty}by_n = exists! stackrel{text{def}}{iff} {exists varepsilon >0 N in mathbb N : exists n ge N implies |by_n - B| ge varepsilon}
$$
Choose some $varepsilon$:
$$
begin{cases}
|ax_n - A| < {varepsilon over 2} \
|by_n - B| ge {varepsilon over 2}
end{cases}
$$
or:
$$
begin{cases}
|ax_n - A| < {varepsilon over 2} \
-|by_n - B| le -{varepsilon over 2}
end{cases}
$$
This is where I got stuck. It feels like i have to use some sort of triangular inequality (either direct or reverse) and find a contradiction. How do I proceed from this point?
calculus sequences-and-series limits convergence epsilon-delta
calculus sequences-and-series limits convergence epsilon-delta
asked Dec 3 '18 at 13:46
romanroman
2,00721222
2,00721222
add a comment |
add a comment |
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
There's more than one way to skin a cat.
The easiest way to prove your point is by knowing another fact, that is:
If ${a_n}$ converges and ${b_n}$ converges and $alpha, betainmathbb R$, then ${alpha a_n + beta b_n}$ also converges.
Using this, you can easily construct a proof by contradiction. That is, you can, assuming that ${x_n}$ converges and ${ax_n + by_n}$ converges, prove that ${y_n}$ must also converge, since $$y_n = frac{1}{b}left(ax_n + by_nright) + left(-frac{a}{b}right)x_n$$
However, if you insist on going by definitions, then you shouldn't just "choose some $epsilon$." The fact that ${y_n}$ does not converge gives you a place where you can start to build your $epsilon$. In particular, choosing some $B$, you can take the $epsilon_y$ which satisfies the property that $forall Ninmathbb Nexists n>N: |y_n - B|>epsilon$.
You can then use this to prove that $acdot A + bcdot B$ cannot be a limit, and since every number can be written as $aA+bB$ for some value $B$, this proves the sequence doesn't converge.
$endgroup$
2
$begingroup$
Why would you want to skin a cat?
$endgroup$
– Zachary Selk
Dec 3 '18 at 13:53
1
$begingroup$
@ZacharySelk Presumably because it got out of the bag, and proceeded to get my tounge in a cat-and-mouse game with some other fat cat, and now it's looking at me like the cat that ate the canary.
$endgroup$
– 5xum
Dec 3 '18 at 14:02
$begingroup$
Thank you very much for your answer, that was very helpful.
$endgroup$
– roman
Dec 3 '18 at 14:55
add a comment |
$begingroup$
For the sake of completeness I'm putting here my further steps based on the hints.
Let:
$$
lim_{nto infty}x_n = A\
lim_{nto infty}y_n = B\
$$
We want to show that $lim_{ntoinfty}(ax_n + by_n)$ exists. Suppose $x_n$ and $y_n$ converge. It is necessary and sufficient $(1)$ to show that:
$$
x_n = A + alpha_n\
y_n = B + beta_n
$$
Where $alpha_n$ and $beta_n$ are infinitely small sequences. Then by definition of a limit we have:
$$
|x_n - A| < varepsilon iff |alpha_n| < varepsilon iff lim_{ntoinfty}alpha_n = 0 \
|y_n - B| < varepsilon iff |beta_n| < varepsilon iff lim_{ntoinfty}beta_n = 0
$$
Take some $a$ and $b$ and consider the following limit:
$$
lim_{ntoinfty}(ax_n + by_n) = lim_{ntoinfty}left((aA + bB) + (aalpha_n + bbeta_n)right) = aA + bB + lim_{ntoinfty}(aalpha_n + bbeta_n)
$$
But any linear combination of infinitely small sequences is an infinitely small sequence. So:
$$
lim_{ntoinfty}(ax_n + by_n) = aA + bB
$$
Now consider the case when $y_n$ diverges, that means that:
$$
|y_n - B| ge varepsilon iff |beta_n| ge varepsilon iff lim_{ntoinfty}beta_n = exists !
$$
So since $y_n$ may not be presented as a sum of some constant and and infinitely small sequence (which violates $(1)$) then $(ax_n + by_n)$ must also diverge.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
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2 Answers
2
active
oldest
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2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
There's more than one way to skin a cat.
The easiest way to prove your point is by knowing another fact, that is:
If ${a_n}$ converges and ${b_n}$ converges and $alpha, betainmathbb R$, then ${alpha a_n + beta b_n}$ also converges.
Using this, you can easily construct a proof by contradiction. That is, you can, assuming that ${x_n}$ converges and ${ax_n + by_n}$ converges, prove that ${y_n}$ must also converge, since $$y_n = frac{1}{b}left(ax_n + by_nright) + left(-frac{a}{b}right)x_n$$
However, if you insist on going by definitions, then you shouldn't just "choose some $epsilon$." The fact that ${y_n}$ does not converge gives you a place where you can start to build your $epsilon$. In particular, choosing some $B$, you can take the $epsilon_y$ which satisfies the property that $forall Ninmathbb Nexists n>N: |y_n - B|>epsilon$.
You can then use this to prove that $acdot A + bcdot B$ cannot be a limit, and since every number can be written as $aA+bB$ for some value $B$, this proves the sequence doesn't converge.
$endgroup$
2
$begingroup$
Why would you want to skin a cat?
$endgroup$
– Zachary Selk
Dec 3 '18 at 13:53
1
$begingroup$
@ZacharySelk Presumably because it got out of the bag, and proceeded to get my tounge in a cat-and-mouse game with some other fat cat, and now it's looking at me like the cat that ate the canary.
$endgroup$
– 5xum
Dec 3 '18 at 14:02
$begingroup$
Thank you very much for your answer, that was very helpful.
$endgroup$
– roman
Dec 3 '18 at 14:55
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There's more than one way to skin a cat.
The easiest way to prove your point is by knowing another fact, that is:
If ${a_n}$ converges and ${b_n}$ converges and $alpha, betainmathbb R$, then ${alpha a_n + beta b_n}$ also converges.
Using this, you can easily construct a proof by contradiction. That is, you can, assuming that ${x_n}$ converges and ${ax_n + by_n}$ converges, prove that ${y_n}$ must also converge, since $$y_n = frac{1}{b}left(ax_n + by_nright) + left(-frac{a}{b}right)x_n$$
However, if you insist on going by definitions, then you shouldn't just "choose some $epsilon$." The fact that ${y_n}$ does not converge gives you a place where you can start to build your $epsilon$. In particular, choosing some $B$, you can take the $epsilon_y$ which satisfies the property that $forall Ninmathbb Nexists n>N: |y_n - B|>epsilon$.
You can then use this to prove that $acdot A + bcdot B$ cannot be a limit, and since every number can be written as $aA+bB$ for some value $B$, this proves the sequence doesn't converge.
$endgroup$
2
$begingroup$
Why would you want to skin a cat?
$endgroup$
– Zachary Selk
Dec 3 '18 at 13:53
1
$begingroup$
@ZacharySelk Presumably because it got out of the bag, and proceeded to get my tounge in a cat-and-mouse game with some other fat cat, and now it's looking at me like the cat that ate the canary.
$endgroup$
– 5xum
Dec 3 '18 at 14:02
$begingroup$
Thank you very much for your answer, that was very helpful.
$endgroup$
– roman
Dec 3 '18 at 14:55
add a comment |
$begingroup$
There's more than one way to skin a cat.
The easiest way to prove your point is by knowing another fact, that is:
If ${a_n}$ converges and ${b_n}$ converges and $alpha, betainmathbb R$, then ${alpha a_n + beta b_n}$ also converges.
Using this, you can easily construct a proof by contradiction. That is, you can, assuming that ${x_n}$ converges and ${ax_n + by_n}$ converges, prove that ${y_n}$ must also converge, since $$y_n = frac{1}{b}left(ax_n + by_nright) + left(-frac{a}{b}right)x_n$$
However, if you insist on going by definitions, then you shouldn't just "choose some $epsilon$." The fact that ${y_n}$ does not converge gives you a place where you can start to build your $epsilon$. In particular, choosing some $B$, you can take the $epsilon_y$ which satisfies the property that $forall Ninmathbb Nexists n>N: |y_n - B|>epsilon$.
You can then use this to prove that $acdot A + bcdot B$ cannot be a limit, and since every number can be written as $aA+bB$ for some value $B$, this proves the sequence doesn't converge.
$endgroup$
There's more than one way to skin a cat.
The easiest way to prove your point is by knowing another fact, that is:
If ${a_n}$ converges and ${b_n}$ converges and $alpha, betainmathbb R$, then ${alpha a_n + beta b_n}$ also converges.
Using this, you can easily construct a proof by contradiction. That is, you can, assuming that ${x_n}$ converges and ${ax_n + by_n}$ converges, prove that ${y_n}$ must also converge, since $$y_n = frac{1}{b}left(ax_n + by_nright) + left(-frac{a}{b}right)x_n$$
However, if you insist on going by definitions, then you shouldn't just "choose some $epsilon$." The fact that ${y_n}$ does not converge gives you a place where you can start to build your $epsilon$. In particular, choosing some $B$, you can take the $epsilon_y$ which satisfies the property that $forall Ninmathbb Nexists n>N: |y_n - B|>epsilon$.
You can then use this to prove that $acdot A + bcdot B$ cannot be a limit, and since every number can be written as $aA+bB$ for some value $B$, this proves the sequence doesn't converge.
edited Dec 3 '18 at 13:56
answered Dec 3 '18 at 13:51
5xum5xum
90.2k394161
90.2k394161
2
$begingroup$
Why would you want to skin a cat?
$endgroup$
– Zachary Selk
Dec 3 '18 at 13:53
1
$begingroup$
@ZacharySelk Presumably because it got out of the bag, and proceeded to get my tounge in a cat-and-mouse game with some other fat cat, and now it's looking at me like the cat that ate the canary.
$endgroup$
– 5xum
Dec 3 '18 at 14:02
$begingroup$
Thank you very much for your answer, that was very helpful.
$endgroup$
– roman
Dec 3 '18 at 14:55
add a comment |
2
$begingroup$
Why would you want to skin a cat?
$endgroup$
– Zachary Selk
Dec 3 '18 at 13:53
1
$begingroup$
@ZacharySelk Presumably because it got out of the bag, and proceeded to get my tounge in a cat-and-mouse game with some other fat cat, and now it's looking at me like the cat that ate the canary.
$endgroup$
– 5xum
Dec 3 '18 at 14:02
$begingroup$
Thank you very much for your answer, that was very helpful.
$endgroup$
– roman
Dec 3 '18 at 14:55
2
2
$begingroup$
Why would you want to skin a cat?
$endgroup$
– Zachary Selk
Dec 3 '18 at 13:53
$begingroup$
Why would you want to skin a cat?
$endgroup$
– Zachary Selk
Dec 3 '18 at 13:53
1
1
$begingroup$
@ZacharySelk Presumably because it got out of the bag, and proceeded to get my tounge in a cat-and-mouse game with some other fat cat, and now it's looking at me like the cat that ate the canary.
$endgroup$
– 5xum
Dec 3 '18 at 14:02
$begingroup$
@ZacharySelk Presumably because it got out of the bag, and proceeded to get my tounge in a cat-and-mouse game with some other fat cat, and now it's looking at me like the cat that ate the canary.
$endgroup$
– 5xum
Dec 3 '18 at 14:02
$begingroup$
Thank you very much for your answer, that was very helpful.
$endgroup$
– roman
Dec 3 '18 at 14:55
$begingroup$
Thank you very much for your answer, that was very helpful.
$endgroup$
– roman
Dec 3 '18 at 14:55
add a comment |
$begingroup$
For the sake of completeness I'm putting here my further steps based on the hints.
Let:
$$
lim_{nto infty}x_n = A\
lim_{nto infty}y_n = B\
$$
We want to show that $lim_{ntoinfty}(ax_n + by_n)$ exists. Suppose $x_n$ and $y_n$ converge. It is necessary and sufficient $(1)$ to show that:
$$
x_n = A + alpha_n\
y_n = B + beta_n
$$
Where $alpha_n$ and $beta_n$ are infinitely small sequences. Then by definition of a limit we have:
$$
|x_n - A| < varepsilon iff |alpha_n| < varepsilon iff lim_{ntoinfty}alpha_n = 0 \
|y_n - B| < varepsilon iff |beta_n| < varepsilon iff lim_{ntoinfty}beta_n = 0
$$
Take some $a$ and $b$ and consider the following limit:
$$
lim_{ntoinfty}(ax_n + by_n) = lim_{ntoinfty}left((aA + bB) + (aalpha_n + bbeta_n)right) = aA + bB + lim_{ntoinfty}(aalpha_n + bbeta_n)
$$
But any linear combination of infinitely small sequences is an infinitely small sequence. So:
$$
lim_{ntoinfty}(ax_n + by_n) = aA + bB
$$
Now consider the case when $y_n$ diverges, that means that:
$$
|y_n - B| ge varepsilon iff |beta_n| ge varepsilon iff lim_{ntoinfty}beta_n = exists !
$$
So since $y_n$ may not be presented as a sum of some constant and and infinitely small sequence (which violates $(1)$) then $(ax_n + by_n)$ must also diverge.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
For the sake of completeness I'm putting here my further steps based on the hints.
Let:
$$
lim_{nto infty}x_n = A\
lim_{nto infty}y_n = B\
$$
We want to show that $lim_{ntoinfty}(ax_n + by_n)$ exists. Suppose $x_n$ and $y_n$ converge. It is necessary and sufficient $(1)$ to show that:
$$
x_n = A + alpha_n\
y_n = B + beta_n
$$
Where $alpha_n$ and $beta_n$ are infinitely small sequences. Then by definition of a limit we have:
$$
|x_n - A| < varepsilon iff |alpha_n| < varepsilon iff lim_{ntoinfty}alpha_n = 0 \
|y_n - B| < varepsilon iff |beta_n| < varepsilon iff lim_{ntoinfty}beta_n = 0
$$
Take some $a$ and $b$ and consider the following limit:
$$
lim_{ntoinfty}(ax_n + by_n) = lim_{ntoinfty}left((aA + bB) + (aalpha_n + bbeta_n)right) = aA + bB + lim_{ntoinfty}(aalpha_n + bbeta_n)
$$
But any linear combination of infinitely small sequences is an infinitely small sequence. So:
$$
lim_{ntoinfty}(ax_n + by_n) = aA + bB
$$
Now consider the case when $y_n$ diverges, that means that:
$$
|y_n - B| ge varepsilon iff |beta_n| ge varepsilon iff lim_{ntoinfty}beta_n = exists !
$$
So since $y_n$ may not be presented as a sum of some constant and and infinitely small sequence (which violates $(1)$) then $(ax_n + by_n)$ must also diverge.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
For the sake of completeness I'm putting here my further steps based on the hints.
Let:
$$
lim_{nto infty}x_n = A\
lim_{nto infty}y_n = B\
$$
We want to show that $lim_{ntoinfty}(ax_n + by_n)$ exists. Suppose $x_n$ and $y_n$ converge. It is necessary and sufficient $(1)$ to show that:
$$
x_n = A + alpha_n\
y_n = B + beta_n
$$
Where $alpha_n$ and $beta_n$ are infinitely small sequences. Then by definition of a limit we have:
$$
|x_n - A| < varepsilon iff |alpha_n| < varepsilon iff lim_{ntoinfty}alpha_n = 0 \
|y_n - B| < varepsilon iff |beta_n| < varepsilon iff lim_{ntoinfty}beta_n = 0
$$
Take some $a$ and $b$ and consider the following limit:
$$
lim_{ntoinfty}(ax_n + by_n) = lim_{ntoinfty}left((aA + bB) + (aalpha_n + bbeta_n)right) = aA + bB + lim_{ntoinfty}(aalpha_n + bbeta_n)
$$
But any linear combination of infinitely small sequences is an infinitely small sequence. So:
$$
lim_{ntoinfty}(ax_n + by_n) = aA + bB
$$
Now consider the case when $y_n$ diverges, that means that:
$$
|y_n - B| ge varepsilon iff |beta_n| ge varepsilon iff lim_{ntoinfty}beta_n = exists !
$$
So since $y_n$ may not be presented as a sum of some constant and and infinitely small sequence (which violates $(1)$) then $(ax_n + by_n)$ must also diverge.
$endgroup$
For the sake of completeness I'm putting here my further steps based on the hints.
Let:
$$
lim_{nto infty}x_n = A\
lim_{nto infty}y_n = B\
$$
We want to show that $lim_{ntoinfty}(ax_n + by_n)$ exists. Suppose $x_n$ and $y_n$ converge. It is necessary and sufficient $(1)$ to show that:
$$
x_n = A + alpha_n\
y_n = B + beta_n
$$
Where $alpha_n$ and $beta_n$ are infinitely small sequences. Then by definition of a limit we have:
$$
|x_n - A| < varepsilon iff |alpha_n| < varepsilon iff lim_{ntoinfty}alpha_n = 0 \
|y_n - B| < varepsilon iff |beta_n| < varepsilon iff lim_{ntoinfty}beta_n = 0
$$
Take some $a$ and $b$ and consider the following limit:
$$
lim_{ntoinfty}(ax_n + by_n) = lim_{ntoinfty}left((aA + bB) + (aalpha_n + bbeta_n)right) = aA + bB + lim_{ntoinfty}(aalpha_n + bbeta_n)
$$
But any linear combination of infinitely small sequences is an infinitely small sequence. So:
$$
lim_{ntoinfty}(ax_n + by_n) = aA + bB
$$
Now consider the case when $y_n$ diverges, that means that:
$$
|y_n - B| ge varepsilon iff |beta_n| ge varepsilon iff lim_{ntoinfty}beta_n = exists !
$$
So since $y_n$ may not be presented as a sum of some constant and and infinitely small sequence (which violates $(1)$) then $(ax_n + by_n)$ must also diverge.
answered Dec 3 '18 at 14:54
romanroman
2,00721222
2,00721222
add a comment |
add a comment |
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StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
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StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
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Post as a guest
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StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
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Sign up using Google
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Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown