How to calculate the surface area of parametric surface?











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Suppose you have the surface $z=3xy$ and you want to find the area that lies within the cylinder $x^2+y^2leq 1$.



My homework is forcing me to use the parameterization



$$textbf{r}_1(s,t)= <scos(t), ssin(t), 3s^2sin(t)cos(t)>$$



I am having a difficult time visualizing this parameterization, and I do not have any graphing software to graph the surface, but I want to make sure I understand this concept.



This is quite obvious, but I want to be sure; using the above parameterization, I am not parameterizing the entire surface, right? If I wanted to, I assume the parameterization would be $$textbf{r}_2(s,t) = <s,t,3st>$$



Instead, is $textbf{r}_1$ just the parameterization adjusted for the region - the region being the cylinder $x^2+y^2leq 1$? That is, are we just making a revolution around $z=3xy$?



Any insight would be helpful.










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    up vote
    3
    down vote

    favorite












    Suppose you have the surface $z=3xy$ and you want to find the area that lies within the cylinder $x^2+y^2leq 1$.



    My homework is forcing me to use the parameterization



    $$textbf{r}_1(s,t)= <scos(t), ssin(t), 3s^2sin(t)cos(t)>$$



    I am having a difficult time visualizing this parameterization, and I do not have any graphing software to graph the surface, but I want to make sure I understand this concept.



    This is quite obvious, but I want to be sure; using the above parameterization, I am not parameterizing the entire surface, right? If I wanted to, I assume the parameterization would be $$textbf{r}_2(s,t) = <s,t,3st>$$



    Instead, is $textbf{r}_1$ just the parameterization adjusted for the region - the region being the cylinder $x^2+y^2leq 1$? That is, are we just making a revolution around $z=3xy$?



    Any insight would be helpful.










    share|cite|improve this question
























      up vote
      3
      down vote

      favorite









      up vote
      3
      down vote

      favorite











      Suppose you have the surface $z=3xy$ and you want to find the area that lies within the cylinder $x^2+y^2leq 1$.



      My homework is forcing me to use the parameterization



      $$textbf{r}_1(s,t)= <scos(t), ssin(t), 3s^2sin(t)cos(t)>$$



      I am having a difficult time visualizing this parameterization, and I do not have any graphing software to graph the surface, but I want to make sure I understand this concept.



      This is quite obvious, but I want to be sure; using the above parameterization, I am not parameterizing the entire surface, right? If I wanted to, I assume the parameterization would be $$textbf{r}_2(s,t) = <s,t,3st>$$



      Instead, is $textbf{r}_1$ just the parameterization adjusted for the region - the region being the cylinder $x^2+y^2leq 1$? That is, are we just making a revolution around $z=3xy$?



      Any insight would be helpful.










      share|cite|improve this question













      Suppose you have the surface $z=3xy$ and you want to find the area that lies within the cylinder $x^2+y^2leq 1$.



      My homework is forcing me to use the parameterization



      $$textbf{r}_1(s,t)= <scos(t), ssin(t), 3s^2sin(t)cos(t)>$$



      I am having a difficult time visualizing this parameterization, and I do not have any graphing software to graph the surface, but I want to make sure I understand this concept.



      This is quite obvious, but I want to be sure; using the above parameterization, I am not parameterizing the entire surface, right? If I wanted to, I assume the parameterization would be $$textbf{r}_2(s,t) = <s,t,3st>$$



      Instead, is $textbf{r}_1$ just the parameterization adjusted for the region - the region being the cylinder $x^2+y^2leq 1$? That is, are we just making a revolution around $z=3xy$?



      Any insight would be helpful.







      multivariable-calculus vectors surfaces parametrization






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          2 Answers
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          accepted










          You can see this exercise as a surface integral or you can also see it as a double integral of a function $f(x,y)$ over the unit disc.





          $mathbf r_1$ is the cylindrical parameterization, which, generally, is
          $$begin{cases}x=scos t\y=ssin t\z=f(x,y)=f(scos t,ssin t)end{cases}$$



          In your case $z=f(x,y)=3xy$. In $mathbf r_1$, the cylinder becomes $sle1$ and you have no limitations on $t$. You have to evaluate the integral
          $$begin{align}int_0^1stimes 3s^2mathrm dsint_0^{2pi}sin(t)cos(t)mathrm dt&=0end{align}$$



          I got to this integral by the following way:



          $$iint f(x,y)mathop{mathrm dx}mathop{mathrm dy}=iint 3xymathop{mathrm dx}mathop{mathrm dy}$$
          Using polar coordinates $(x=scos t, y=ssin t)$ and adding the Jacobian:
          $$iint3s^3sin tcos tmathop{mathrm ds}mathop{mathrm dt}$$
          Because we are in the unit disc, $0<sle1, quad0<t<2pi$
          $$int_0^13s^3left(int_0^{2pi}sin tcos tmathop{mathrm dt}right)mathop{mathrm ds}$$






          share|cite|improve this answer























          • The three upvotes and acceptance notwithstanding this answer is seriously wrong. Why should the area in question be $=0>$? We have a real "floppy disc" here!
            – Christian Blatter
            yesterday










          • I think the integrand is right, the limits of integration could be wrong. I tried to evaluate the integral in cartesian coordinates and I got $0$ again: $oint_{x^2+y^2le1}3xymathop{mathrm dxmathrm dy}=3int_{-1}^1xmathop{mathrm dx} int_{-sqrt{1-x^2}}^{sqrt{1-x^2}}ymathop{mathrm dy}=0$. I honestly do not see where the mistake is
            – Lorenzo B.
            yesterday












          • I understand your answer (+1). Why mine is wrong?
            – Lorenzo B.
            yesterday










          • What made you arrive at the integrand $3s^3cos tsin t>$? – That's my last word on this matter.
            – Christian Blatter
            yesterday




















          up vote
          4
          down vote













          Since in the end you have to integrate over the unit disc in the $(x,y)$-plane your source proposes to use polar coordinates instead of $x$ and $y$ as parameters. Then $x=scos t$, $y=ssin t$. In this way the idea $z=3xy$ $>(x^2+y^2leq1)$ translates into
          $${bf r}(s,t)=(scos t,ssin t,3s^2cos tsin t)qquad(0leq sleq 1, 0leq tleq2pi) .$$
          In order to find the area of this floppy disc $F$ we have to compute
          $${bf r}_s=(cos t,sin t, 6scos tsin t),quad {bf r}_t=bigl(-ssin t,scos t ,3s^2cos(2t)bigr)$$
          and then
          $${bf r}_stimes{bf r}_t=(ldots,ldots,ldots) .$$
          The area is then finally given as
          $${rm area}(F)=int_0^1int_0^{2pi}bigl|{bf r}_stimes{bf r}_tbigr|>dt>ds .$$
          The resulting integral will be simpler than dreaded.






          share|cite|improve this answer























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            2 Answers
            2






            active

            oldest

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            2 Answers
            2






            active

            oldest

            votes









            active

            oldest

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            active

            oldest

            votes








            up vote
            1
            down vote



            accepted










            You can see this exercise as a surface integral or you can also see it as a double integral of a function $f(x,y)$ over the unit disc.





            $mathbf r_1$ is the cylindrical parameterization, which, generally, is
            $$begin{cases}x=scos t\y=ssin t\z=f(x,y)=f(scos t,ssin t)end{cases}$$



            In your case $z=f(x,y)=3xy$. In $mathbf r_1$, the cylinder becomes $sle1$ and you have no limitations on $t$. You have to evaluate the integral
            $$begin{align}int_0^1stimes 3s^2mathrm dsint_0^{2pi}sin(t)cos(t)mathrm dt&=0end{align}$$



            I got to this integral by the following way:



            $$iint f(x,y)mathop{mathrm dx}mathop{mathrm dy}=iint 3xymathop{mathrm dx}mathop{mathrm dy}$$
            Using polar coordinates $(x=scos t, y=ssin t)$ and adding the Jacobian:
            $$iint3s^3sin tcos tmathop{mathrm ds}mathop{mathrm dt}$$
            Because we are in the unit disc, $0<sle1, quad0<t<2pi$
            $$int_0^13s^3left(int_0^{2pi}sin tcos tmathop{mathrm dt}right)mathop{mathrm ds}$$






            share|cite|improve this answer























            • The three upvotes and acceptance notwithstanding this answer is seriously wrong. Why should the area in question be $=0>$? We have a real "floppy disc" here!
              – Christian Blatter
              yesterday










            • I think the integrand is right, the limits of integration could be wrong. I tried to evaluate the integral in cartesian coordinates and I got $0$ again: $oint_{x^2+y^2le1}3xymathop{mathrm dxmathrm dy}=3int_{-1}^1xmathop{mathrm dx} int_{-sqrt{1-x^2}}^{sqrt{1-x^2}}ymathop{mathrm dy}=0$. I honestly do not see where the mistake is
              – Lorenzo B.
              yesterday












            • I understand your answer (+1). Why mine is wrong?
              – Lorenzo B.
              yesterday










            • What made you arrive at the integrand $3s^3cos tsin t>$? – That's my last word on this matter.
              – Christian Blatter
              yesterday

















            up vote
            1
            down vote



            accepted










            You can see this exercise as a surface integral or you can also see it as a double integral of a function $f(x,y)$ over the unit disc.





            $mathbf r_1$ is the cylindrical parameterization, which, generally, is
            $$begin{cases}x=scos t\y=ssin t\z=f(x,y)=f(scos t,ssin t)end{cases}$$



            In your case $z=f(x,y)=3xy$. In $mathbf r_1$, the cylinder becomes $sle1$ and you have no limitations on $t$. You have to evaluate the integral
            $$begin{align}int_0^1stimes 3s^2mathrm dsint_0^{2pi}sin(t)cos(t)mathrm dt&=0end{align}$$



            I got to this integral by the following way:



            $$iint f(x,y)mathop{mathrm dx}mathop{mathrm dy}=iint 3xymathop{mathrm dx}mathop{mathrm dy}$$
            Using polar coordinates $(x=scos t, y=ssin t)$ and adding the Jacobian:
            $$iint3s^3sin tcos tmathop{mathrm ds}mathop{mathrm dt}$$
            Because we are in the unit disc, $0<sle1, quad0<t<2pi$
            $$int_0^13s^3left(int_0^{2pi}sin tcos tmathop{mathrm dt}right)mathop{mathrm ds}$$






            share|cite|improve this answer























            • The three upvotes and acceptance notwithstanding this answer is seriously wrong. Why should the area in question be $=0>$? We have a real "floppy disc" here!
              – Christian Blatter
              yesterday










            • I think the integrand is right, the limits of integration could be wrong. I tried to evaluate the integral in cartesian coordinates and I got $0$ again: $oint_{x^2+y^2le1}3xymathop{mathrm dxmathrm dy}=3int_{-1}^1xmathop{mathrm dx} int_{-sqrt{1-x^2}}^{sqrt{1-x^2}}ymathop{mathrm dy}=0$. I honestly do not see where the mistake is
              – Lorenzo B.
              yesterday












            • I understand your answer (+1). Why mine is wrong?
              – Lorenzo B.
              yesterday










            • What made you arrive at the integrand $3s^3cos tsin t>$? – That's my last word on this matter.
              – Christian Blatter
              yesterday















            up vote
            1
            down vote



            accepted







            up vote
            1
            down vote



            accepted






            You can see this exercise as a surface integral or you can also see it as a double integral of a function $f(x,y)$ over the unit disc.





            $mathbf r_1$ is the cylindrical parameterization, which, generally, is
            $$begin{cases}x=scos t\y=ssin t\z=f(x,y)=f(scos t,ssin t)end{cases}$$



            In your case $z=f(x,y)=3xy$. In $mathbf r_1$, the cylinder becomes $sle1$ and you have no limitations on $t$. You have to evaluate the integral
            $$begin{align}int_0^1stimes 3s^2mathrm dsint_0^{2pi}sin(t)cos(t)mathrm dt&=0end{align}$$



            I got to this integral by the following way:



            $$iint f(x,y)mathop{mathrm dx}mathop{mathrm dy}=iint 3xymathop{mathrm dx}mathop{mathrm dy}$$
            Using polar coordinates $(x=scos t, y=ssin t)$ and adding the Jacobian:
            $$iint3s^3sin tcos tmathop{mathrm ds}mathop{mathrm dt}$$
            Because we are in the unit disc, $0<sle1, quad0<t<2pi$
            $$int_0^13s^3left(int_0^{2pi}sin tcos tmathop{mathrm dt}right)mathop{mathrm ds}$$






            share|cite|improve this answer














            You can see this exercise as a surface integral or you can also see it as a double integral of a function $f(x,y)$ over the unit disc.





            $mathbf r_1$ is the cylindrical parameterization, which, generally, is
            $$begin{cases}x=scos t\y=ssin t\z=f(x,y)=f(scos t,ssin t)end{cases}$$



            In your case $z=f(x,y)=3xy$. In $mathbf r_1$, the cylinder becomes $sle1$ and you have no limitations on $t$. You have to evaluate the integral
            $$begin{align}int_0^1stimes 3s^2mathrm dsint_0^{2pi}sin(t)cos(t)mathrm dt&=0end{align}$$



            I got to this integral by the following way:



            $$iint f(x,y)mathop{mathrm dx}mathop{mathrm dy}=iint 3xymathop{mathrm dx}mathop{mathrm dy}$$
            Using polar coordinates $(x=scos t, y=ssin t)$ and adding the Jacobian:
            $$iint3s^3sin tcos tmathop{mathrm ds}mathop{mathrm dt}$$
            Because we are in the unit disc, $0<sle1, quad0<t<2pi$
            $$int_0^13s^3left(int_0^{2pi}sin tcos tmathop{mathrm dt}right)mathop{mathrm ds}$$







            share|cite|improve this answer














            share|cite|improve this answer



            share|cite|improve this answer








            edited yesterday

























            answered yesterday









            Lorenzo B.

            1,6222419




            1,6222419












            • The three upvotes and acceptance notwithstanding this answer is seriously wrong. Why should the area in question be $=0>$? We have a real "floppy disc" here!
              – Christian Blatter
              yesterday










            • I think the integrand is right, the limits of integration could be wrong. I tried to evaluate the integral in cartesian coordinates and I got $0$ again: $oint_{x^2+y^2le1}3xymathop{mathrm dxmathrm dy}=3int_{-1}^1xmathop{mathrm dx} int_{-sqrt{1-x^2}}^{sqrt{1-x^2}}ymathop{mathrm dy}=0$. I honestly do not see where the mistake is
              – Lorenzo B.
              yesterday












            • I understand your answer (+1). Why mine is wrong?
              – Lorenzo B.
              yesterday










            • What made you arrive at the integrand $3s^3cos tsin t>$? – That's my last word on this matter.
              – Christian Blatter
              yesterday




















            • The three upvotes and acceptance notwithstanding this answer is seriously wrong. Why should the area in question be $=0>$? We have a real "floppy disc" here!
              – Christian Blatter
              yesterday










            • I think the integrand is right, the limits of integration could be wrong. I tried to evaluate the integral in cartesian coordinates and I got $0$ again: $oint_{x^2+y^2le1}3xymathop{mathrm dxmathrm dy}=3int_{-1}^1xmathop{mathrm dx} int_{-sqrt{1-x^2}}^{sqrt{1-x^2}}ymathop{mathrm dy}=0$. I honestly do not see where the mistake is
              – Lorenzo B.
              yesterday












            • I understand your answer (+1). Why mine is wrong?
              – Lorenzo B.
              yesterday










            • What made you arrive at the integrand $3s^3cos tsin t>$? – That's my last word on this matter.
              – Christian Blatter
              yesterday


















            The three upvotes and acceptance notwithstanding this answer is seriously wrong. Why should the area in question be $=0>$? We have a real "floppy disc" here!
            – Christian Blatter
            yesterday




            The three upvotes and acceptance notwithstanding this answer is seriously wrong. Why should the area in question be $=0>$? We have a real "floppy disc" here!
            – Christian Blatter
            yesterday












            I think the integrand is right, the limits of integration could be wrong. I tried to evaluate the integral in cartesian coordinates and I got $0$ again: $oint_{x^2+y^2le1}3xymathop{mathrm dxmathrm dy}=3int_{-1}^1xmathop{mathrm dx} int_{-sqrt{1-x^2}}^{sqrt{1-x^2}}ymathop{mathrm dy}=0$. I honestly do not see where the mistake is
            – Lorenzo B.
            yesterday






            I think the integrand is right, the limits of integration could be wrong. I tried to evaluate the integral in cartesian coordinates and I got $0$ again: $oint_{x^2+y^2le1}3xymathop{mathrm dxmathrm dy}=3int_{-1}^1xmathop{mathrm dx} int_{-sqrt{1-x^2}}^{sqrt{1-x^2}}ymathop{mathrm dy}=0$. I honestly do not see where the mistake is
            – Lorenzo B.
            yesterday














            I understand your answer (+1). Why mine is wrong?
            – Lorenzo B.
            yesterday




            I understand your answer (+1). Why mine is wrong?
            – Lorenzo B.
            yesterday












            What made you arrive at the integrand $3s^3cos tsin t>$? – That's my last word on this matter.
            – Christian Blatter
            yesterday






            What made you arrive at the integrand $3s^3cos tsin t>$? – That's my last word on this matter.
            – Christian Blatter
            yesterday












            up vote
            4
            down vote













            Since in the end you have to integrate over the unit disc in the $(x,y)$-plane your source proposes to use polar coordinates instead of $x$ and $y$ as parameters. Then $x=scos t$, $y=ssin t$. In this way the idea $z=3xy$ $>(x^2+y^2leq1)$ translates into
            $${bf r}(s,t)=(scos t,ssin t,3s^2cos tsin t)qquad(0leq sleq 1, 0leq tleq2pi) .$$
            In order to find the area of this floppy disc $F$ we have to compute
            $${bf r}_s=(cos t,sin t, 6scos tsin t),quad {bf r}_t=bigl(-ssin t,scos t ,3s^2cos(2t)bigr)$$
            and then
            $${bf r}_stimes{bf r}_t=(ldots,ldots,ldots) .$$
            The area is then finally given as
            $${rm area}(F)=int_0^1int_0^{2pi}bigl|{bf r}_stimes{bf r}_tbigr|>dt>ds .$$
            The resulting integral will be simpler than dreaded.






            share|cite|improve this answer



























              up vote
              4
              down vote













              Since in the end you have to integrate over the unit disc in the $(x,y)$-plane your source proposes to use polar coordinates instead of $x$ and $y$ as parameters. Then $x=scos t$, $y=ssin t$. In this way the idea $z=3xy$ $>(x^2+y^2leq1)$ translates into
              $${bf r}(s,t)=(scos t,ssin t,3s^2cos tsin t)qquad(0leq sleq 1, 0leq tleq2pi) .$$
              In order to find the area of this floppy disc $F$ we have to compute
              $${bf r}_s=(cos t,sin t, 6scos tsin t),quad {bf r}_t=bigl(-ssin t,scos t ,3s^2cos(2t)bigr)$$
              and then
              $${bf r}_stimes{bf r}_t=(ldots,ldots,ldots) .$$
              The area is then finally given as
              $${rm area}(F)=int_0^1int_0^{2pi}bigl|{bf r}_stimes{bf r}_tbigr|>dt>ds .$$
              The resulting integral will be simpler than dreaded.






              share|cite|improve this answer

























                up vote
                4
                down vote










                up vote
                4
                down vote









                Since in the end you have to integrate over the unit disc in the $(x,y)$-plane your source proposes to use polar coordinates instead of $x$ and $y$ as parameters. Then $x=scos t$, $y=ssin t$. In this way the idea $z=3xy$ $>(x^2+y^2leq1)$ translates into
                $${bf r}(s,t)=(scos t,ssin t,3s^2cos tsin t)qquad(0leq sleq 1, 0leq tleq2pi) .$$
                In order to find the area of this floppy disc $F$ we have to compute
                $${bf r}_s=(cos t,sin t, 6scos tsin t),quad {bf r}_t=bigl(-ssin t,scos t ,3s^2cos(2t)bigr)$$
                and then
                $${bf r}_stimes{bf r}_t=(ldots,ldots,ldots) .$$
                The area is then finally given as
                $${rm area}(F)=int_0^1int_0^{2pi}bigl|{bf r}_stimes{bf r}_tbigr|>dt>ds .$$
                The resulting integral will be simpler than dreaded.






                share|cite|improve this answer














                Since in the end you have to integrate over the unit disc in the $(x,y)$-plane your source proposes to use polar coordinates instead of $x$ and $y$ as parameters. Then $x=scos t$, $y=ssin t$. In this way the idea $z=3xy$ $>(x^2+y^2leq1)$ translates into
                $${bf r}(s,t)=(scos t,ssin t,3s^2cos tsin t)qquad(0leq sleq 1, 0leq tleq2pi) .$$
                In order to find the area of this floppy disc $F$ we have to compute
                $${bf r}_s=(cos t,sin t, 6scos tsin t),quad {bf r}_t=bigl(-ssin t,scos t ,3s^2cos(2t)bigr)$$
                and then
                $${bf r}_stimes{bf r}_t=(ldots,ldots,ldots) .$$
                The area is then finally given as
                $${rm area}(F)=int_0^1int_0^{2pi}bigl|{bf r}_stimes{bf r}_tbigr|>dt>ds .$$
                The resulting integral will be simpler than dreaded.







                share|cite|improve this answer














                share|cite|improve this answer



                share|cite|improve this answer








                edited yesterday

























                answered yesterday









                Christian Blatter

                170k7111324




                170k7111324






























                     

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