Which of the following statements are true for $A={tsin(frac{1}{t}) | tin (0,frac{2}{pi})}$?
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Let $A={tsin(frac{1}{t}) | tin (0,frac{2}{pi})}$.
Then
$sup (A)<frac{2}{pi}+frac{1}{npi}$ for all $nge 1$.
$inf (A)> frac{-2}{3pi}-frac{1}{npi}$ for all $nge 1$.
- $sup (A)=1$
- $inf (A)=-1$
My answer was options $1$ and $2$ which matched with prelim answer key provided by organization, but the final answer key changed the answer to option $1$ only. Why is option $2$ not correct?
My attempt-
As $-tle tsin(1/t)le t$. So $tsin(1/t)$ will always be less than $frac{2}{pi}$ which is strictly less than $1$. So option $3$ is false and option $1$ is true. Also value of $tsin(1/t)$ is always greater than or equal to $-2/pi=-0.63$, so infimum cannot be $-1$.
Now at $t=2/3pi$ , function has value $frac{-2}{3pi}$. So if option $2$ is false we must have some value of $t$ in $A$ for which the function attains value strictly less than $frac{-2}{3pi}$. Right?
Can you please help me with option $2$ now. Thanks in advance.
real-analysis supremum-and-infimum
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add a comment |
$begingroup$
Let $A={tsin(frac{1}{t}) | tin (0,frac{2}{pi})}$.
Then
$sup (A)<frac{2}{pi}+frac{1}{npi}$ for all $nge 1$.
$inf (A)> frac{-2}{3pi}-frac{1}{npi}$ for all $nge 1$.
- $sup (A)=1$
- $inf (A)=-1$
My answer was options $1$ and $2$ which matched with prelim answer key provided by organization, but the final answer key changed the answer to option $1$ only. Why is option $2$ not correct?
My attempt-
As $-tle tsin(1/t)le t$. So $tsin(1/t)$ will always be less than $frac{2}{pi}$ which is strictly less than $1$. So option $3$ is false and option $1$ is true. Also value of $tsin(1/t)$ is always greater than or equal to $-2/pi=-0.63$, so infimum cannot be $-1$.
Now at $t=2/3pi$ , function has value $frac{-2}{3pi}$. So if option $2$ is false we must have some value of $t$ in $A$ for which the function attains value strictly less than $frac{-2}{3pi}$. Right?
Can you please help me with option $2$ now. Thanks in advance.
real-analysis supremum-and-infimum
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Please show us some work.
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– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 17:28
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@GNUSupporter8964民主女神地下教會 please see edit.
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– blabla
Nov 30 '18 at 17:51
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Are you sure it's $-1/(npi)$ in option $2$ and not $+1/(npi)$ ?
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– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 17:56
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@Thinking yes...
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– blabla
Nov 30 '18 at 18:00
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Thx for pinging me. Close vote removed.
$endgroup$
– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 18:56
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Let $A={tsin(frac{1}{t}) | tin (0,frac{2}{pi})}$.
Then
$sup (A)<frac{2}{pi}+frac{1}{npi}$ for all $nge 1$.
$inf (A)> frac{-2}{3pi}-frac{1}{npi}$ for all $nge 1$.
- $sup (A)=1$
- $inf (A)=-1$
My answer was options $1$ and $2$ which matched with prelim answer key provided by organization, but the final answer key changed the answer to option $1$ only. Why is option $2$ not correct?
My attempt-
As $-tle tsin(1/t)le t$. So $tsin(1/t)$ will always be less than $frac{2}{pi}$ which is strictly less than $1$. So option $3$ is false and option $1$ is true. Also value of $tsin(1/t)$ is always greater than or equal to $-2/pi=-0.63$, so infimum cannot be $-1$.
Now at $t=2/3pi$ , function has value $frac{-2}{3pi}$. So if option $2$ is false we must have some value of $t$ in $A$ for which the function attains value strictly less than $frac{-2}{3pi}$. Right?
Can you please help me with option $2$ now. Thanks in advance.
real-analysis supremum-and-infimum
$endgroup$
Let $A={tsin(frac{1}{t}) | tin (0,frac{2}{pi})}$.
Then
$sup (A)<frac{2}{pi}+frac{1}{npi}$ for all $nge 1$.
$inf (A)> frac{-2}{3pi}-frac{1}{npi}$ for all $nge 1$.
- $sup (A)=1$
- $inf (A)=-1$
My answer was options $1$ and $2$ which matched with prelim answer key provided by organization, but the final answer key changed the answer to option $1$ only. Why is option $2$ not correct?
My attempt-
As $-tle tsin(1/t)le t$. So $tsin(1/t)$ will always be less than $frac{2}{pi}$ which is strictly less than $1$. So option $3$ is false and option $1$ is true. Also value of $tsin(1/t)$ is always greater than or equal to $-2/pi=-0.63$, so infimum cannot be $-1$.
Now at $t=2/3pi$ , function has value $frac{-2}{3pi}$. So if option $2$ is false we must have some value of $t$ in $A$ for which the function attains value strictly less than $frac{-2}{3pi}$. Right?
Can you please help me with option $2$ now. Thanks in advance.
real-analysis supremum-and-infimum
real-analysis supremum-and-infimum
edited Nov 30 '18 at 18:23
blabla
asked Nov 30 '18 at 17:24
blablablabla
425211
425211
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Please show us some work.
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– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 17:28
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@GNUSupporter8964民主女神地下教會 please see edit.
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– blabla
Nov 30 '18 at 17:51
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Are you sure it's $-1/(npi)$ in option $2$ and not $+1/(npi)$ ?
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– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 17:56
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@Thinking yes...
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– blabla
Nov 30 '18 at 18:00
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Thx for pinging me. Close vote removed.
$endgroup$
– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 18:56
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Please show us some work.
$endgroup$
– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 17:28
$begingroup$
@GNUSupporter8964民主女神地下教會 please see edit.
$endgroup$
– blabla
Nov 30 '18 at 17:51
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Are you sure it's $-1/(npi)$ in option $2$ and not $+1/(npi)$ ?
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 17:56
$begingroup$
@Thinking yes...
$endgroup$
– blabla
Nov 30 '18 at 18:00
$begingroup$
Thx for pinging me. Close vote removed.
$endgroup$
– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 18:56
$begingroup$
Please show us some work.
$endgroup$
– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 17:28
$begingroup$
Please show us some work.
$endgroup$
– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 17:28
$begingroup$
@GNUSupporter8964民主女神地下教會 please see edit.
$endgroup$
– blabla
Nov 30 '18 at 17:51
$begingroup$
@GNUSupporter8964民主女神地下教會 please see edit.
$endgroup$
– blabla
Nov 30 '18 at 17:51
$begingroup$
Are you sure it's $-1/(npi)$ in option $2$ and not $+1/(npi)$ ?
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 17:56
$begingroup$
Are you sure it's $-1/(npi)$ in option $2$ and not $+1/(npi)$ ?
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 17:56
$begingroup$
@Thinking yes...
$endgroup$
– blabla
Nov 30 '18 at 18:00
$begingroup$
@Thinking yes...
$endgroup$
– blabla
Nov 30 '18 at 18:00
$begingroup$
Thx for pinging me. Close vote removed.
$endgroup$
– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 18:56
$begingroup$
Thx for pinging me. Close vote removed.
$endgroup$
– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 18:56
add a comment |
4 Answers
4
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If the option $2$ is true, it means that $$inf Age -{2over 3pi}$$ since $inf A> -{2over 3pi}-{1over npi}$ is true for all $n>1$. Since $$large tsin {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}in A}=-{2over 3pi}$$ then we must have $inf A= -{2over 3pi}$ and $$large {dover dt}tsin {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}in A}=0$$ because the infimum is equal to minimum now (since it is attained in $t={2over 3pi}in A$) and as the function is differentiable in $A$. But this doesn't hold since $$large {dover dt}tsin {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}in A}=large sin {1over t}-{1over t}cos {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}}=-1ne 0$$therefore option $2$ is incorrect.
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(you have functions of $t$ but you evaluate at $x=...$)
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– Calvin Khor
Nov 30 '18 at 19:55
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Thank you for heads up. That was a typo....
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– Mostafa Ayaz
Nov 30 '18 at 20:04
add a comment |
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The graph of $sin(1/t)$ turns at $t=2/3pi$, but this is not true of $tsin(1/t)$. Multiplying by $t$ has the effect of pushing the minimum point to the right and down slightly.
Since $a>b-frac{1}{pi n}$ for all $nge 1$ iff $age b$, we are done.
To see this without a graph, lets start from your correct observation that for $f(t) = tsin (1/t)$, $f(2/3pi) = -2/3pi$. The derivative at this point however is
$$ f'(3pi/2) = sin(3pi/2) + 2/3pi cos(3pi/2) = -1 $$
Since $f$ is smooth on a small neighbourhood of $2/3pi$, $f'le -1/2<0$ on this neighbourhood. Thus $f$ is decreasing at $2/3pi$.
Something slightly more general is true:
Suppose $f$ is smooth, $f(1)=0=f(2)$, $fle 0$ and $f$ has a unique non degenerate minimum point $x_0$ in $[1,2]$. Then $g(x)=xf(x)$ has a minimum point to the right and below of $x_0$.
Proof- by a similar computation to the above, $g$ is decreasing at $x_0$. As $g(2)=2f(2)=0$, we conclude by Intermediate Value Theorem and Rolles' Theorem.
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Can you prove it using the first derivative test?
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– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 19:10
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@GNUSupporter8964民主女神地下教會 do you mean the claim that the minimum is pushed to the right?
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– Calvin Khor
Nov 30 '18 at 19:12
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Yes, thx for edit.
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– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 20:12
add a comment |
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Like some other answers, but written differently:
Let $f(t)= tsin(1/t).$ Then $f'(t)= sin(1/t) - [cos (1/t)]/t$ for $t>0.$ Thus $f'(2/(3pi)) = -1.$ Hence for $t$ near and to the right of $2/(3pi),$ we have
$$frac{f(t)-f(2/(3pi)}{t-2/(3pi)}<-frac{1}{2}.$$
For such $t$ we have $f(t)<f(2/(3pi)=-2/(3pi).$ Hence $inf A <-2/(3pi),$ which implies 2. does not hold.
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add a comment |
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Let $x=1/timplies A={frac{sin x}x:x>pi/2}$
Let $f(x)=frac{sin x}x, x>pi/2$
$f(3pi/2)=-frac2{3pi}<0, f'(3pi/2)>0implies f$ is strictly increasing at $3pi/2$
This means you can find $ainvarepsilon-$neighbourhood of $3pi/2$ such that $f(a)<f(3pi/2)implies f(a)<-frac2{3pi}$
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This is wrong. The fact that $f'(a) < 0$ doesn't mean there is a neighbourhood of $a$ where the function is strictly decreasing. Take for example : $xmapsto x+10x^2sin(1/x)$
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– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 18:47
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at $0$ it doesn't verify what you are saying
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– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 19:22
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$sin x/x$ is continuously differentiable for $x>pi/2$
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– Shubham Johri
Nov 30 '18 at 19:26
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That's not my point. Look at my first comment.
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– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 19:27
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The result holds for continuously differentiable functions. $x+10x^2sin(1/x)$ is not continuously differentiable at $0$.
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– Shubham Johri
Nov 30 '18 at 19:37
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4 Answers
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4 Answers
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$begingroup$
If the option $2$ is true, it means that $$inf Age -{2over 3pi}$$ since $inf A> -{2over 3pi}-{1over npi}$ is true for all $n>1$. Since $$large tsin {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}in A}=-{2over 3pi}$$ then we must have $inf A= -{2over 3pi}$ and $$large {dover dt}tsin {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}in A}=0$$ because the infimum is equal to minimum now (since it is attained in $t={2over 3pi}in A$) and as the function is differentiable in $A$. But this doesn't hold since $$large {dover dt}tsin {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}in A}=large sin {1over t}-{1over t}cos {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}}=-1ne 0$$therefore option $2$ is incorrect.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
(you have functions of $t$ but you evaluate at $x=...$)
$endgroup$
– Calvin Khor
Nov 30 '18 at 19:55
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Thank you for heads up. That was a typo....
$endgroup$
– Mostafa Ayaz
Nov 30 '18 at 20:04
add a comment |
$begingroup$
If the option $2$ is true, it means that $$inf Age -{2over 3pi}$$ since $inf A> -{2over 3pi}-{1over npi}$ is true for all $n>1$. Since $$large tsin {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}in A}=-{2over 3pi}$$ then we must have $inf A= -{2over 3pi}$ and $$large {dover dt}tsin {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}in A}=0$$ because the infimum is equal to minimum now (since it is attained in $t={2over 3pi}in A$) and as the function is differentiable in $A$. But this doesn't hold since $$large {dover dt}tsin {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}in A}=large sin {1over t}-{1over t}cos {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}}=-1ne 0$$therefore option $2$ is incorrect.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
(you have functions of $t$ but you evaluate at $x=...$)
$endgroup$
– Calvin Khor
Nov 30 '18 at 19:55
$begingroup$
Thank you for heads up. That was a typo....
$endgroup$
– Mostafa Ayaz
Nov 30 '18 at 20:04
add a comment |
$begingroup$
If the option $2$ is true, it means that $$inf Age -{2over 3pi}$$ since $inf A> -{2over 3pi}-{1over npi}$ is true for all $n>1$. Since $$large tsin {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}in A}=-{2over 3pi}$$ then we must have $inf A= -{2over 3pi}$ and $$large {dover dt}tsin {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}in A}=0$$ because the infimum is equal to minimum now (since it is attained in $t={2over 3pi}in A$) and as the function is differentiable in $A$. But this doesn't hold since $$large {dover dt}tsin {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}in A}=large sin {1over t}-{1over t}cos {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}}=-1ne 0$$therefore option $2$ is incorrect.
$endgroup$
If the option $2$ is true, it means that $$inf Age -{2over 3pi}$$ since $inf A> -{2over 3pi}-{1over npi}$ is true for all $n>1$. Since $$large tsin {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}in A}=-{2over 3pi}$$ then we must have $inf A= -{2over 3pi}$ and $$large {dover dt}tsin {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}in A}=0$$ because the infimum is equal to minimum now (since it is attained in $t={2over 3pi}in A$) and as the function is differentiable in $A$. But this doesn't hold since $$large {dover dt}tsin {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}in A}=large sin {1over t}-{1over t}cos {1over t}Big|_{t={2over 3pi}}=-1ne 0$$therefore option $2$ is incorrect.
edited Nov 30 '18 at 20:03
answered Nov 30 '18 at 19:10
Mostafa AyazMostafa Ayaz
14.8k3938
14.8k3938
$begingroup$
(you have functions of $t$ but you evaluate at $x=...$)
$endgroup$
– Calvin Khor
Nov 30 '18 at 19:55
$begingroup$
Thank you for heads up. That was a typo....
$endgroup$
– Mostafa Ayaz
Nov 30 '18 at 20:04
add a comment |
$begingroup$
(you have functions of $t$ but you evaluate at $x=...$)
$endgroup$
– Calvin Khor
Nov 30 '18 at 19:55
$begingroup$
Thank you for heads up. That was a typo....
$endgroup$
– Mostafa Ayaz
Nov 30 '18 at 20:04
$begingroup$
(you have functions of $t$ but you evaluate at $x=...$)
$endgroup$
– Calvin Khor
Nov 30 '18 at 19:55
$begingroup$
(you have functions of $t$ but you evaluate at $x=...$)
$endgroup$
– Calvin Khor
Nov 30 '18 at 19:55
$begingroup$
Thank you for heads up. That was a typo....
$endgroup$
– Mostafa Ayaz
Nov 30 '18 at 20:04
$begingroup$
Thank you for heads up. That was a typo....
$endgroup$
– Mostafa Ayaz
Nov 30 '18 at 20:04
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The graph of $sin(1/t)$ turns at $t=2/3pi$, but this is not true of $tsin(1/t)$. Multiplying by $t$ has the effect of pushing the minimum point to the right and down slightly.
Since $a>b-frac{1}{pi n}$ for all $nge 1$ iff $age b$, we are done.
To see this without a graph, lets start from your correct observation that for $f(t) = tsin (1/t)$, $f(2/3pi) = -2/3pi$. The derivative at this point however is
$$ f'(3pi/2) = sin(3pi/2) + 2/3pi cos(3pi/2) = -1 $$
Since $f$ is smooth on a small neighbourhood of $2/3pi$, $f'le -1/2<0$ on this neighbourhood. Thus $f$ is decreasing at $2/3pi$.
Something slightly more general is true:
Suppose $f$ is smooth, $f(1)=0=f(2)$, $fle 0$ and $f$ has a unique non degenerate minimum point $x_0$ in $[1,2]$. Then $g(x)=xf(x)$ has a minimum point to the right and below of $x_0$.
Proof- by a similar computation to the above, $g$ is decreasing at $x_0$. As $g(2)=2f(2)=0$, we conclude by Intermediate Value Theorem and Rolles' Theorem.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Can you prove it using the first derivative test?
$endgroup$
– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 19:10
$begingroup$
@GNUSupporter8964民主女神地下教會 do you mean the claim that the minimum is pushed to the right?
$endgroup$
– Calvin Khor
Nov 30 '18 at 19:12
$begingroup$
Yes, thx for edit.
$endgroup$
– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 20:12
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The graph of $sin(1/t)$ turns at $t=2/3pi$, but this is not true of $tsin(1/t)$. Multiplying by $t$ has the effect of pushing the minimum point to the right and down slightly.
Since $a>b-frac{1}{pi n}$ for all $nge 1$ iff $age b$, we are done.
To see this without a graph, lets start from your correct observation that for $f(t) = tsin (1/t)$, $f(2/3pi) = -2/3pi$. The derivative at this point however is
$$ f'(3pi/2) = sin(3pi/2) + 2/3pi cos(3pi/2) = -1 $$
Since $f$ is smooth on a small neighbourhood of $2/3pi$, $f'le -1/2<0$ on this neighbourhood. Thus $f$ is decreasing at $2/3pi$.
Something slightly more general is true:
Suppose $f$ is smooth, $f(1)=0=f(2)$, $fle 0$ and $f$ has a unique non degenerate minimum point $x_0$ in $[1,2]$. Then $g(x)=xf(x)$ has a minimum point to the right and below of $x_0$.
Proof- by a similar computation to the above, $g$ is decreasing at $x_0$. As $g(2)=2f(2)=0$, we conclude by Intermediate Value Theorem and Rolles' Theorem.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Can you prove it using the first derivative test?
$endgroup$
– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 19:10
$begingroup$
@GNUSupporter8964民主女神地下教會 do you mean the claim that the minimum is pushed to the right?
$endgroup$
– Calvin Khor
Nov 30 '18 at 19:12
$begingroup$
Yes, thx for edit.
$endgroup$
– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 20:12
add a comment |
$begingroup$
The graph of $sin(1/t)$ turns at $t=2/3pi$, but this is not true of $tsin(1/t)$. Multiplying by $t$ has the effect of pushing the minimum point to the right and down slightly.
Since $a>b-frac{1}{pi n}$ for all $nge 1$ iff $age b$, we are done.
To see this without a graph, lets start from your correct observation that for $f(t) = tsin (1/t)$, $f(2/3pi) = -2/3pi$. The derivative at this point however is
$$ f'(3pi/2) = sin(3pi/2) + 2/3pi cos(3pi/2) = -1 $$
Since $f$ is smooth on a small neighbourhood of $2/3pi$, $f'le -1/2<0$ on this neighbourhood. Thus $f$ is decreasing at $2/3pi$.
Something slightly more general is true:
Suppose $f$ is smooth, $f(1)=0=f(2)$, $fle 0$ and $f$ has a unique non degenerate minimum point $x_0$ in $[1,2]$. Then $g(x)=xf(x)$ has a minimum point to the right and below of $x_0$.
Proof- by a similar computation to the above, $g$ is decreasing at $x_0$. As $g(2)=2f(2)=0$, we conclude by Intermediate Value Theorem and Rolles' Theorem.
$endgroup$
The graph of $sin(1/t)$ turns at $t=2/3pi$, but this is not true of $tsin(1/t)$. Multiplying by $t$ has the effect of pushing the minimum point to the right and down slightly.
Since $a>b-frac{1}{pi n}$ for all $nge 1$ iff $age b$, we are done.
To see this without a graph, lets start from your correct observation that for $f(t) = tsin (1/t)$, $f(2/3pi) = -2/3pi$. The derivative at this point however is
$$ f'(3pi/2) = sin(3pi/2) + 2/3pi cos(3pi/2) = -1 $$
Since $f$ is smooth on a small neighbourhood of $2/3pi$, $f'le -1/2<0$ on this neighbourhood. Thus $f$ is decreasing at $2/3pi$.
Something slightly more general is true:
Suppose $f$ is smooth, $f(1)=0=f(2)$, $fle 0$ and $f$ has a unique non degenerate minimum point $x_0$ in $[1,2]$. Then $g(x)=xf(x)$ has a minimum point to the right and below of $x_0$.
Proof- by a similar computation to the above, $g$ is decreasing at $x_0$. As $g(2)=2f(2)=0$, we conclude by Intermediate Value Theorem and Rolles' Theorem.
edited Nov 30 '18 at 19:30
answered Nov 30 '18 at 18:34
Calvin KhorCalvin Khor
11.2k21438
11.2k21438
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Can you prove it using the first derivative test?
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– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 19:10
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@GNUSupporter8964民主女神地下教會 do you mean the claim that the minimum is pushed to the right?
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– Calvin Khor
Nov 30 '18 at 19:12
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Yes, thx for edit.
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– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 20:12
add a comment |
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Can you prove it using the first derivative test?
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– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 19:10
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@GNUSupporter8964民主女神地下教會 do you mean the claim that the minimum is pushed to the right?
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– Calvin Khor
Nov 30 '18 at 19:12
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Yes, thx for edit.
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– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 20:12
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Can you prove it using the first derivative test?
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– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 19:10
$begingroup$
Can you prove it using the first derivative test?
$endgroup$
– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 19:10
$begingroup$
@GNUSupporter8964民主女神地下教會 do you mean the claim that the minimum is pushed to the right?
$endgroup$
– Calvin Khor
Nov 30 '18 at 19:12
$begingroup$
@GNUSupporter8964民主女神地下教會 do you mean the claim that the minimum is pushed to the right?
$endgroup$
– Calvin Khor
Nov 30 '18 at 19:12
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Yes, thx for edit.
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– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 20:12
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Yes, thx for edit.
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– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 20:12
add a comment |
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Like some other answers, but written differently:
Let $f(t)= tsin(1/t).$ Then $f'(t)= sin(1/t) - [cos (1/t)]/t$ for $t>0.$ Thus $f'(2/(3pi)) = -1.$ Hence for $t$ near and to the right of $2/(3pi),$ we have
$$frac{f(t)-f(2/(3pi)}{t-2/(3pi)}<-frac{1}{2}.$$
For such $t$ we have $f(t)<f(2/(3pi)=-2/(3pi).$ Hence $inf A <-2/(3pi),$ which implies 2. does not hold.
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add a comment |
$begingroup$
Like some other answers, but written differently:
Let $f(t)= tsin(1/t).$ Then $f'(t)= sin(1/t) - [cos (1/t)]/t$ for $t>0.$ Thus $f'(2/(3pi)) = -1.$ Hence for $t$ near and to the right of $2/(3pi),$ we have
$$frac{f(t)-f(2/(3pi)}{t-2/(3pi)}<-frac{1}{2}.$$
For such $t$ we have $f(t)<f(2/(3pi)=-2/(3pi).$ Hence $inf A <-2/(3pi),$ which implies 2. does not hold.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
Like some other answers, but written differently:
Let $f(t)= tsin(1/t).$ Then $f'(t)= sin(1/t) - [cos (1/t)]/t$ for $t>0.$ Thus $f'(2/(3pi)) = -1.$ Hence for $t$ near and to the right of $2/(3pi),$ we have
$$frac{f(t)-f(2/(3pi)}{t-2/(3pi)}<-frac{1}{2}.$$
For such $t$ we have $f(t)<f(2/(3pi)=-2/(3pi).$ Hence $inf A <-2/(3pi),$ which implies 2. does not hold.
$endgroup$
Like some other answers, but written differently:
Let $f(t)= tsin(1/t).$ Then $f'(t)= sin(1/t) - [cos (1/t)]/t$ for $t>0.$ Thus $f'(2/(3pi)) = -1.$ Hence for $t$ near and to the right of $2/(3pi),$ we have
$$frac{f(t)-f(2/(3pi)}{t-2/(3pi)}<-frac{1}{2}.$$
For such $t$ we have $f(t)<f(2/(3pi)=-2/(3pi).$ Hence $inf A <-2/(3pi),$ which implies 2. does not hold.
answered Nov 30 '18 at 20:04
zhw.zhw.
71.8k43075
71.8k43075
add a comment |
add a comment |
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Let $x=1/timplies A={frac{sin x}x:x>pi/2}$
Let $f(x)=frac{sin x}x, x>pi/2$
$f(3pi/2)=-frac2{3pi}<0, f'(3pi/2)>0implies f$ is strictly increasing at $3pi/2$
This means you can find $ainvarepsilon-$neighbourhood of $3pi/2$ such that $f(a)<f(3pi/2)implies f(a)<-frac2{3pi}$
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This is wrong. The fact that $f'(a) < 0$ doesn't mean there is a neighbourhood of $a$ where the function is strictly decreasing. Take for example : $xmapsto x+10x^2sin(1/x)$
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– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 18:47
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at $0$ it doesn't verify what you are saying
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– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 19:22
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$sin x/x$ is continuously differentiable for $x>pi/2$
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– Shubham Johri
Nov 30 '18 at 19:26
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That's not my point. Look at my first comment.
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– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 19:27
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The result holds for continuously differentiable functions. $x+10x^2sin(1/x)$ is not continuously differentiable at $0$.
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– Shubham Johri
Nov 30 '18 at 19:37
|
show 3 more comments
$begingroup$
Let $x=1/timplies A={frac{sin x}x:x>pi/2}$
Let $f(x)=frac{sin x}x, x>pi/2$
$f(3pi/2)=-frac2{3pi}<0, f'(3pi/2)>0implies f$ is strictly increasing at $3pi/2$
This means you can find $ainvarepsilon-$neighbourhood of $3pi/2$ such that $f(a)<f(3pi/2)implies f(a)<-frac2{3pi}$
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
This is wrong. The fact that $f'(a) < 0$ doesn't mean there is a neighbourhood of $a$ where the function is strictly decreasing. Take for example : $xmapsto x+10x^2sin(1/x)$
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 18:47
$begingroup$
at $0$ it doesn't verify what you are saying
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 19:22
$begingroup$
$sin x/x$ is continuously differentiable for $x>pi/2$
$endgroup$
– Shubham Johri
Nov 30 '18 at 19:26
$begingroup$
That's not my point. Look at my first comment.
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 19:27
$begingroup$
The result holds for continuously differentiable functions. $x+10x^2sin(1/x)$ is not continuously differentiable at $0$.
$endgroup$
– Shubham Johri
Nov 30 '18 at 19:37
|
show 3 more comments
$begingroup$
Let $x=1/timplies A={frac{sin x}x:x>pi/2}$
Let $f(x)=frac{sin x}x, x>pi/2$
$f(3pi/2)=-frac2{3pi}<0, f'(3pi/2)>0implies f$ is strictly increasing at $3pi/2$
This means you can find $ainvarepsilon-$neighbourhood of $3pi/2$ such that $f(a)<f(3pi/2)implies f(a)<-frac2{3pi}$
$endgroup$
Let $x=1/timplies A={frac{sin x}x:x>pi/2}$
Let $f(x)=frac{sin x}x, x>pi/2$
$f(3pi/2)=-frac2{3pi}<0, f'(3pi/2)>0implies f$ is strictly increasing at $3pi/2$
This means you can find $ainvarepsilon-$neighbourhood of $3pi/2$ such that $f(a)<f(3pi/2)implies f(a)<-frac2{3pi}$
answered Nov 30 '18 at 18:31
Shubham JohriShubham Johri
4,666717
4,666717
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This is wrong. The fact that $f'(a) < 0$ doesn't mean there is a neighbourhood of $a$ where the function is strictly decreasing. Take for example : $xmapsto x+10x^2sin(1/x)$
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 18:47
$begingroup$
at $0$ it doesn't verify what you are saying
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 19:22
$begingroup$
$sin x/x$ is continuously differentiable for $x>pi/2$
$endgroup$
– Shubham Johri
Nov 30 '18 at 19:26
$begingroup$
That's not my point. Look at my first comment.
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 19:27
$begingroup$
The result holds for continuously differentiable functions. $x+10x^2sin(1/x)$ is not continuously differentiable at $0$.
$endgroup$
– Shubham Johri
Nov 30 '18 at 19:37
|
show 3 more comments
$begingroup$
This is wrong. The fact that $f'(a) < 0$ doesn't mean there is a neighbourhood of $a$ where the function is strictly decreasing. Take for example : $xmapsto x+10x^2sin(1/x)$
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 18:47
$begingroup$
at $0$ it doesn't verify what you are saying
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 19:22
$begingroup$
$sin x/x$ is continuously differentiable for $x>pi/2$
$endgroup$
– Shubham Johri
Nov 30 '18 at 19:26
$begingroup$
That's not my point. Look at my first comment.
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 19:27
$begingroup$
The result holds for continuously differentiable functions. $x+10x^2sin(1/x)$ is not continuously differentiable at $0$.
$endgroup$
– Shubham Johri
Nov 30 '18 at 19:37
$begingroup$
This is wrong. The fact that $f'(a) < 0$ doesn't mean there is a neighbourhood of $a$ where the function is strictly decreasing. Take for example : $xmapsto x+10x^2sin(1/x)$
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 18:47
$begingroup$
This is wrong. The fact that $f'(a) < 0$ doesn't mean there is a neighbourhood of $a$ where the function is strictly decreasing. Take for example : $xmapsto x+10x^2sin(1/x)$
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 18:47
$begingroup$
at $0$ it doesn't verify what you are saying
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 19:22
$begingroup$
at $0$ it doesn't verify what you are saying
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 19:22
$begingroup$
$sin x/x$ is continuously differentiable for $x>pi/2$
$endgroup$
– Shubham Johri
Nov 30 '18 at 19:26
$begingroup$
$sin x/x$ is continuously differentiable for $x>pi/2$
$endgroup$
– Shubham Johri
Nov 30 '18 at 19:26
$begingroup$
That's not my point. Look at my first comment.
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 19:27
$begingroup$
That's not my point. Look at my first comment.
$endgroup$
– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 19:27
$begingroup$
The result holds for continuously differentiable functions. $x+10x^2sin(1/x)$ is not continuously differentiable at $0$.
$endgroup$
– Shubham Johri
Nov 30 '18 at 19:37
$begingroup$
The result holds for continuously differentiable functions. $x+10x^2sin(1/x)$ is not continuously differentiable at $0$.
$endgroup$
– Shubham Johri
Nov 30 '18 at 19:37
|
show 3 more comments
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– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 17:28
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@GNUSupporter8964民主女神地下教會 please see edit.
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– blabla
Nov 30 '18 at 17:51
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Are you sure it's $-1/(npi)$ in option $2$ and not $+1/(npi)$ ?
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– Thinking
Nov 30 '18 at 17:56
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@Thinking yes...
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– blabla
Nov 30 '18 at 18:00
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Thx for pinging me. Close vote removed.
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– GNUSupporter 8964民主女神 地下教會
Nov 30 '18 at 18:56