Scaling and rotating a square so that it is inscribed in the original square
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I have a square with a side length of 100 cm. I then want to rotate a square clockwise by ten degrees so that it is scaled and contained inside the existing square.
The image below is what I'm attempting, but with a square, not a triangle. (Image created by Alain Matthes).
And here is the square I'm trying to create, so hopefully this helps:
So my question, how do I determine the distance between the original point and the rotated point? Or, how do I determine the location of the rotated point on its own, independent of the original square? I'm not sure what formula I would use in either instance.
Any assistance in this endeavor would be greatly appreciated.
geometry euclidean-geometry rotations polygons art
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add a comment |
$begingroup$
I have a square with a side length of 100 cm. I then want to rotate a square clockwise by ten degrees so that it is scaled and contained inside the existing square.
The image below is what I'm attempting, but with a square, not a triangle. (Image created by Alain Matthes).
And here is the square I'm trying to create, so hopefully this helps:
So my question, how do I determine the distance between the original point and the rotated point? Or, how do I determine the location of the rotated point on its own, independent of the original square? I'm not sure what formula I would use in either instance.
Any assistance in this endeavor would be greatly appreciated.
geometry euclidean-geometry rotations polygons art
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I've already drawn what I'm trying to achieve. what is the normal server used by users who want to upload their own images for this site? thanks.
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– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 22:57
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From what I can tell, you can choose to just add image and it will give you the option of uploading one from your own computer.
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– Johanna
Jan 7 '15 at 23:06
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yeah i found somewhere to upload it, thanks much
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– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:18
add a comment |
$begingroup$
I have a square with a side length of 100 cm. I then want to rotate a square clockwise by ten degrees so that it is scaled and contained inside the existing square.
The image below is what I'm attempting, but with a square, not a triangle. (Image created by Alain Matthes).
And here is the square I'm trying to create, so hopefully this helps:
So my question, how do I determine the distance between the original point and the rotated point? Or, how do I determine the location of the rotated point on its own, independent of the original square? I'm not sure what formula I would use in either instance.
Any assistance in this endeavor would be greatly appreciated.
geometry euclidean-geometry rotations polygons art
$endgroup$
I have a square with a side length of 100 cm. I then want to rotate a square clockwise by ten degrees so that it is scaled and contained inside the existing square.
The image below is what I'm attempting, but with a square, not a triangle. (Image created by Alain Matthes).
And here is the square I'm trying to create, so hopefully this helps:
So my question, how do I determine the distance between the original point and the rotated point? Or, how do I determine the location of the rotated point on its own, independent of the original square? I'm not sure what formula I would use in either instance.
Any assistance in this endeavor would be greatly appreciated.
geometry euclidean-geometry rotations polygons art
geometry euclidean-geometry rotations polygons art
edited Dec 24 '18 at 9:03
Glorfindel
3,41381830
3,41381830
asked Jan 7 '15 at 22:43
jb3330421jb3330421
515
515
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I've already drawn what I'm trying to achieve. what is the normal server used by users who want to upload their own images for this site? thanks.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 22:57
$begingroup$
From what I can tell, you can choose to just add image and it will give you the option of uploading one from your own computer.
$endgroup$
– Johanna
Jan 7 '15 at 23:06
$begingroup$
yeah i found somewhere to upload it, thanks much
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:18
add a comment |
$begingroup$
I've already drawn what I'm trying to achieve. what is the normal server used by users who want to upload their own images for this site? thanks.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 22:57
$begingroup$
From what I can tell, you can choose to just add image and it will give you the option of uploading one from your own computer.
$endgroup$
– Johanna
Jan 7 '15 at 23:06
$begingroup$
yeah i found somewhere to upload it, thanks much
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:18
$begingroup$
I've already drawn what I'm trying to achieve. what is the normal server used by users who want to upload their own images for this site? thanks.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 22:57
$begingroup$
I've already drawn what I'm trying to achieve. what is the normal server used by users who want to upload their own images for this site? thanks.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 22:57
$begingroup$
From what I can tell, you can choose to just add image and it will give you the option of uploading one from your own computer.
$endgroup$
– Johanna
Jan 7 '15 at 23:06
$begingroup$
From what I can tell, you can choose to just add image and it will give you the option of uploading one from your own computer.
$endgroup$
– Johanna
Jan 7 '15 at 23:06
$begingroup$
yeah i found somewhere to upload it, thanks much
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:18
$begingroup$
yeah i found somewhere to upload it, thanks much
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:18
add a comment |
3 Answers
3
active
oldest
votes
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A more general approach is given as follows. Suppose we have the points $$zeta_{n,0}^k = left( cos frac{2pi k}{n}, sin frac{2pi k}{n} right), quad k = 0, 1, 2, ldots, n-1$$ forming a regular $n$-gon with unit circumradius in the Cartesian coordinate plane. We seek a linear transformation $T$ that maps $zeta_{n,0}^k$ to a point $zeta_{n,1}^k$ that satisfies the following properties: $$begin{align*} zeta_{n,1}^k &= T(zeta_{n,0}^k) = (1-lambda) zeta_{n,0}^k + lambda zeta_{n,0}^{overline{k+1}}, \ T(0,0) &= (0,0), end{align*}$$ for each such $k$, where $overline{k+1}$ is the remainder of $k+1$ divided by $n$. Here, $lambda in (0,1)$ is a fixed constant. This suggests a rotation by some angle $theta$ and scaling by $s$ will work: i.e., $$T(x,y) = begin{bmatrix}s cos theta & -s sin theta \ s sin theta & s cos theta end{bmatrix}begin{bmatrix} x \ y end{bmatrix}$$ or if we want to use complex numbers as suggested by our choice of $zeta$, $$T(z) = se^{itheta}zeta_{n,0}^k = se^{itheta}e^{2pi i k/n} = se^{i(2pi k/n + theta)} = (1-lambda)e^{2pi i k/n} + lambda e^{2pi i (k+1)/n}.$$ Equivalently, $$se^{itheta} = 1 + lambda(zeta_{n,0} - 1).$$ Solving for $s$ and $theta$ in terms of $lambda$, we obtain $$s = sqrt{Bigl(1 - lambda + lambda cos frac{2pi}{n}Bigr)^2 + lambda^2 sin^2 frac{2pi}{n}} = sqrt{1 - 2lambda + 2lambda^2 + 2lambda(1-lambda) cos frac{2pi}{n}},$$ $$theta = tan^{-1} frac{sin frac{2pi}{n}}{frac{1}{lambda} - 1 + cos frac{2pi}{n}}.$$ The resulting rotation matrix then has the form $$T = begin{bmatrix} 1 - lambda + lambda cos frac{2pi}{n} & -lambda sin frac{2pi}{n} \ lambda sin frac{2pi}{n} & 1 - lambda + lambda cos frac{2pi}{n} end{bmatrix}.$$ Subsequent iterations of $T$ will produce nested $n$-gons with vertices $$T^m(zeta_{n,0}^k) = zeta_{n,m}^k.$$
Below is a rather primitive implementation of the above in Mathematica, for $n = 7$ and gradually incrementing $lambda in [0.05, 0.95]$:
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Let's say your original 4 points are, going counterclockwise from the origin, $$(0,0),(100,0),(100,100),(0,100)$$
You want to rotate clockwise, which means the point that was on the origin will go up to $(0,a)$ and the point that was at $(0,100)$ will go to $(a,100)$. And if you draw out this new situation with all 4 little wedges filling in the space between your new square and the old, you can make triangles with a small leg of $a$ and a long leg of $b$ and you see that $a+b=100$.
So you have a system of two equations and two unknowns.
$$a+b=100\tan(10^{circ})=frac{a}{b}$$
This gives $aapprox14.99$. Your new 4 points will be
$$(0,14.99),(85.01,0),(100,85.01),(14.99,100)$$
Additionally, each side length was scaled by $0.8632$
EDIT: How to solve the system without a calculator solve() function.
- Find a numerical value of $tan(10^{circ})$. It is $0.1763$
- Solve the first equation in terms of $a$ so $a=100-b$
- Solve $0.1763=(100-b)/b$ or $0.1763b=100-b\1.1763b=100\b=100/1.1763\b=85.01$
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Thank you for this. So forgive my ignorance, but how did you solve for a with those two equations? I have tan at .176, but how did you know a is 14.99. thanks again.
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– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:46
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Ha, i used a calculator :). I'll edit my answer to show how to do it without a solver...
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– turkeyhundt
Jan 7 '15 at 23:47
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great, thank you, i appreciate it.
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– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:50
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This is fantastic, thanks for your help. This is my first time using this site. What an amazing resource for math idiots like myself.
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– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:56
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Sorry, now my last question: when you add b to both sides, how come .01763 becomes 1.1763, and not .01763b +b? Did I miss something there?
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– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:58
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You have two correct answers already.
What I would like to do is to put the solution in terms that you can
very easily apply to your problem, that is, I want to give you a simple formula
to directly compute the coordinates of each vertex of each square.
Let's take polar coordinates with the origin at the center of the square, so that the large square in your diagram has vertices at
$(r_0,0)$, $left(r_0,fracpi2right)$, $(r_0,pi)$, $left(r_0,-fracpi2right)$
where $r_0$ is a positive constant determined by how large you want that square to be.
Now we rotate $delta$ radians to the right and shrink the square so that the new
square's vertices lie on the old square's edges.
(For a $10^circ$ rotation, you want $delta = frac{pi}{180} cdot 10.$)
Then the origin, one vertex of the original square, and the corresponding vertex of
the new square make a triangle with angle $delta$ at the origin, $fracpi4$ ($45^circ$)
at the original square's vertex, and $frac{3pi}{4}-delta$ at the new square's vertex.
Let $r_1$ be the distance from the origin to the new square's vertex.
By the law of sines,
$$ frac{r_1}{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}
= frac{r_0}{sin left(frac{3pi}{4}-deltaright)}.$$
Therefore
$$r_1 = frac{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}{sin left(frac{3pi}{4}-deltaright)} r_0
= frac{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}{sin left(frac{pi}{4}+deltaright)} r_0.$$
Let
$$rho = frac{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}{sin left(frac{pi}{4}+deltaright)}$$
so that $r_1 = rho, r_0.$
For an angle of $10^circ,$ a little computation shows that $rho approx 0.86321799,$
that is,
$$r_1 approx 0.86321799, r_0.$$
Checking this against the calculations by @turkeyhundt for the $10$-degree rotation,
we should find that $0.86321799 approx frac{sqrt{a^2+b^2}}{100},$
and indeed for $b = 85.01,$ $a=100-b$ that is what we find.
Now observe that in general, if $r_n$ is the distance from the origin to a vertex
of the $n$th square, then $r_{n+1} = rho, r_n.$
Also, if $alpha$ is the direction from the origin to a vertex of the $n$th square,
then the direction from the origin to a vertex of the $n+1$st square is
$alpha-delta$ (because polar coordinates measure angles counterclockwise
and we are rotating clockwise).
Putting these facts together, the vertices of the $n$th square
have polar coordinates
$$
(rho^n r_0,; -ndelta),\
left(rho^n r_0,; fracpi2-ndeltaright)!,\
(rho^n r_0,; pi-ndelta),\
left(rho^n r_0,; -fracpi2-ndeltaright)!.
$$
To plot these in Cartesian coordinates, convert the $(r,theta)$ coordinates
of each vertex of each square to $(x,y)$ coordinate by the usual
transformation, $x=rcostheta$ and $y=rsintheta.$
For example, one vertex of the $n$th square will have Cartesian coordinates
$(rho^n r_0 cos(-ndelta), rho^n r_0 sin(-ndelta)),$ and for the other
three you simply add a multiple of $fracpi2$ to the angle.
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3 Answers
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3 Answers
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$begingroup$
A more general approach is given as follows. Suppose we have the points $$zeta_{n,0}^k = left( cos frac{2pi k}{n}, sin frac{2pi k}{n} right), quad k = 0, 1, 2, ldots, n-1$$ forming a regular $n$-gon with unit circumradius in the Cartesian coordinate plane. We seek a linear transformation $T$ that maps $zeta_{n,0}^k$ to a point $zeta_{n,1}^k$ that satisfies the following properties: $$begin{align*} zeta_{n,1}^k &= T(zeta_{n,0}^k) = (1-lambda) zeta_{n,0}^k + lambda zeta_{n,0}^{overline{k+1}}, \ T(0,0) &= (0,0), end{align*}$$ for each such $k$, where $overline{k+1}$ is the remainder of $k+1$ divided by $n$. Here, $lambda in (0,1)$ is a fixed constant. This suggests a rotation by some angle $theta$ and scaling by $s$ will work: i.e., $$T(x,y) = begin{bmatrix}s cos theta & -s sin theta \ s sin theta & s cos theta end{bmatrix}begin{bmatrix} x \ y end{bmatrix}$$ or if we want to use complex numbers as suggested by our choice of $zeta$, $$T(z) = se^{itheta}zeta_{n,0}^k = se^{itheta}e^{2pi i k/n} = se^{i(2pi k/n + theta)} = (1-lambda)e^{2pi i k/n} + lambda e^{2pi i (k+1)/n}.$$ Equivalently, $$se^{itheta} = 1 + lambda(zeta_{n,0} - 1).$$ Solving for $s$ and $theta$ in terms of $lambda$, we obtain $$s = sqrt{Bigl(1 - lambda + lambda cos frac{2pi}{n}Bigr)^2 + lambda^2 sin^2 frac{2pi}{n}} = sqrt{1 - 2lambda + 2lambda^2 + 2lambda(1-lambda) cos frac{2pi}{n}},$$ $$theta = tan^{-1} frac{sin frac{2pi}{n}}{frac{1}{lambda} - 1 + cos frac{2pi}{n}}.$$ The resulting rotation matrix then has the form $$T = begin{bmatrix} 1 - lambda + lambda cos frac{2pi}{n} & -lambda sin frac{2pi}{n} \ lambda sin frac{2pi}{n} & 1 - lambda + lambda cos frac{2pi}{n} end{bmatrix}.$$ Subsequent iterations of $T$ will produce nested $n$-gons with vertices $$T^m(zeta_{n,0}^k) = zeta_{n,m}^k.$$
Below is a rather primitive implementation of the above in Mathematica, for $n = 7$ and gradually incrementing $lambda in [0.05, 0.95]$:
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add a comment |
$begingroup$
A more general approach is given as follows. Suppose we have the points $$zeta_{n,0}^k = left( cos frac{2pi k}{n}, sin frac{2pi k}{n} right), quad k = 0, 1, 2, ldots, n-1$$ forming a regular $n$-gon with unit circumradius in the Cartesian coordinate plane. We seek a linear transformation $T$ that maps $zeta_{n,0}^k$ to a point $zeta_{n,1}^k$ that satisfies the following properties: $$begin{align*} zeta_{n,1}^k &= T(zeta_{n,0}^k) = (1-lambda) zeta_{n,0}^k + lambda zeta_{n,0}^{overline{k+1}}, \ T(0,0) &= (0,0), end{align*}$$ for each such $k$, where $overline{k+1}$ is the remainder of $k+1$ divided by $n$. Here, $lambda in (0,1)$ is a fixed constant. This suggests a rotation by some angle $theta$ and scaling by $s$ will work: i.e., $$T(x,y) = begin{bmatrix}s cos theta & -s sin theta \ s sin theta & s cos theta end{bmatrix}begin{bmatrix} x \ y end{bmatrix}$$ or if we want to use complex numbers as suggested by our choice of $zeta$, $$T(z) = se^{itheta}zeta_{n,0}^k = se^{itheta}e^{2pi i k/n} = se^{i(2pi k/n + theta)} = (1-lambda)e^{2pi i k/n} + lambda e^{2pi i (k+1)/n}.$$ Equivalently, $$se^{itheta} = 1 + lambda(zeta_{n,0} - 1).$$ Solving for $s$ and $theta$ in terms of $lambda$, we obtain $$s = sqrt{Bigl(1 - lambda + lambda cos frac{2pi}{n}Bigr)^2 + lambda^2 sin^2 frac{2pi}{n}} = sqrt{1 - 2lambda + 2lambda^2 + 2lambda(1-lambda) cos frac{2pi}{n}},$$ $$theta = tan^{-1} frac{sin frac{2pi}{n}}{frac{1}{lambda} - 1 + cos frac{2pi}{n}}.$$ The resulting rotation matrix then has the form $$T = begin{bmatrix} 1 - lambda + lambda cos frac{2pi}{n} & -lambda sin frac{2pi}{n} \ lambda sin frac{2pi}{n} & 1 - lambda + lambda cos frac{2pi}{n} end{bmatrix}.$$ Subsequent iterations of $T$ will produce nested $n$-gons with vertices $$T^m(zeta_{n,0}^k) = zeta_{n,m}^k.$$
Below is a rather primitive implementation of the above in Mathematica, for $n = 7$ and gradually incrementing $lambda in [0.05, 0.95]$:
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add a comment |
$begingroup$
A more general approach is given as follows. Suppose we have the points $$zeta_{n,0}^k = left( cos frac{2pi k}{n}, sin frac{2pi k}{n} right), quad k = 0, 1, 2, ldots, n-1$$ forming a regular $n$-gon with unit circumradius in the Cartesian coordinate plane. We seek a linear transformation $T$ that maps $zeta_{n,0}^k$ to a point $zeta_{n,1}^k$ that satisfies the following properties: $$begin{align*} zeta_{n,1}^k &= T(zeta_{n,0}^k) = (1-lambda) zeta_{n,0}^k + lambda zeta_{n,0}^{overline{k+1}}, \ T(0,0) &= (0,0), end{align*}$$ for each such $k$, where $overline{k+1}$ is the remainder of $k+1$ divided by $n$. Here, $lambda in (0,1)$ is a fixed constant. This suggests a rotation by some angle $theta$ and scaling by $s$ will work: i.e., $$T(x,y) = begin{bmatrix}s cos theta & -s sin theta \ s sin theta & s cos theta end{bmatrix}begin{bmatrix} x \ y end{bmatrix}$$ or if we want to use complex numbers as suggested by our choice of $zeta$, $$T(z) = se^{itheta}zeta_{n,0}^k = se^{itheta}e^{2pi i k/n} = se^{i(2pi k/n + theta)} = (1-lambda)e^{2pi i k/n} + lambda e^{2pi i (k+1)/n}.$$ Equivalently, $$se^{itheta} = 1 + lambda(zeta_{n,0} - 1).$$ Solving for $s$ and $theta$ in terms of $lambda$, we obtain $$s = sqrt{Bigl(1 - lambda + lambda cos frac{2pi}{n}Bigr)^2 + lambda^2 sin^2 frac{2pi}{n}} = sqrt{1 - 2lambda + 2lambda^2 + 2lambda(1-lambda) cos frac{2pi}{n}},$$ $$theta = tan^{-1} frac{sin frac{2pi}{n}}{frac{1}{lambda} - 1 + cos frac{2pi}{n}}.$$ The resulting rotation matrix then has the form $$T = begin{bmatrix} 1 - lambda + lambda cos frac{2pi}{n} & -lambda sin frac{2pi}{n} \ lambda sin frac{2pi}{n} & 1 - lambda + lambda cos frac{2pi}{n} end{bmatrix}.$$ Subsequent iterations of $T$ will produce nested $n$-gons with vertices $$T^m(zeta_{n,0}^k) = zeta_{n,m}^k.$$
Below is a rather primitive implementation of the above in Mathematica, for $n = 7$ and gradually incrementing $lambda in [0.05, 0.95]$:
$endgroup$
A more general approach is given as follows. Suppose we have the points $$zeta_{n,0}^k = left( cos frac{2pi k}{n}, sin frac{2pi k}{n} right), quad k = 0, 1, 2, ldots, n-1$$ forming a regular $n$-gon with unit circumradius in the Cartesian coordinate plane. We seek a linear transformation $T$ that maps $zeta_{n,0}^k$ to a point $zeta_{n,1}^k$ that satisfies the following properties: $$begin{align*} zeta_{n,1}^k &= T(zeta_{n,0}^k) = (1-lambda) zeta_{n,0}^k + lambda zeta_{n,0}^{overline{k+1}}, \ T(0,0) &= (0,0), end{align*}$$ for each such $k$, where $overline{k+1}$ is the remainder of $k+1$ divided by $n$. Here, $lambda in (0,1)$ is a fixed constant. This suggests a rotation by some angle $theta$ and scaling by $s$ will work: i.e., $$T(x,y) = begin{bmatrix}s cos theta & -s sin theta \ s sin theta & s cos theta end{bmatrix}begin{bmatrix} x \ y end{bmatrix}$$ or if we want to use complex numbers as suggested by our choice of $zeta$, $$T(z) = se^{itheta}zeta_{n,0}^k = se^{itheta}e^{2pi i k/n} = se^{i(2pi k/n + theta)} = (1-lambda)e^{2pi i k/n} + lambda e^{2pi i (k+1)/n}.$$ Equivalently, $$se^{itheta} = 1 + lambda(zeta_{n,0} - 1).$$ Solving for $s$ and $theta$ in terms of $lambda$, we obtain $$s = sqrt{Bigl(1 - lambda + lambda cos frac{2pi}{n}Bigr)^2 + lambda^2 sin^2 frac{2pi}{n}} = sqrt{1 - 2lambda + 2lambda^2 + 2lambda(1-lambda) cos frac{2pi}{n}},$$ $$theta = tan^{-1} frac{sin frac{2pi}{n}}{frac{1}{lambda} - 1 + cos frac{2pi}{n}}.$$ The resulting rotation matrix then has the form $$T = begin{bmatrix} 1 - lambda + lambda cos frac{2pi}{n} & -lambda sin frac{2pi}{n} \ lambda sin frac{2pi}{n} & 1 - lambda + lambda cos frac{2pi}{n} end{bmatrix}.$$ Subsequent iterations of $T$ will produce nested $n$-gons with vertices $$T^m(zeta_{n,0}^k) = zeta_{n,m}^k.$$
Below is a rather primitive implementation of the above in Mathematica, for $n = 7$ and gradually incrementing $lambda in [0.05, 0.95]$:
edited Jan 8 '15 at 0:15
answered Jan 8 '15 at 0:07
heropupheropup
65.1k865104
65.1k865104
add a comment |
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Let's say your original 4 points are, going counterclockwise from the origin, $$(0,0),(100,0),(100,100),(0,100)$$
You want to rotate clockwise, which means the point that was on the origin will go up to $(0,a)$ and the point that was at $(0,100)$ will go to $(a,100)$. And if you draw out this new situation with all 4 little wedges filling in the space between your new square and the old, you can make triangles with a small leg of $a$ and a long leg of $b$ and you see that $a+b=100$.
So you have a system of two equations and two unknowns.
$$a+b=100\tan(10^{circ})=frac{a}{b}$$
This gives $aapprox14.99$. Your new 4 points will be
$$(0,14.99),(85.01,0),(100,85.01),(14.99,100)$$
Additionally, each side length was scaled by $0.8632$
EDIT: How to solve the system without a calculator solve() function.
- Find a numerical value of $tan(10^{circ})$. It is $0.1763$
- Solve the first equation in terms of $a$ so $a=100-b$
- Solve $0.1763=(100-b)/b$ or $0.1763b=100-b\1.1763b=100\b=100/1.1763\b=85.01$
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Thank you for this. So forgive my ignorance, but how did you solve for a with those two equations? I have tan at .176, but how did you know a is 14.99. thanks again.
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– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:46
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Ha, i used a calculator :). I'll edit my answer to show how to do it without a solver...
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– turkeyhundt
Jan 7 '15 at 23:47
$begingroup$
great, thank you, i appreciate it.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:50
$begingroup$
This is fantastic, thanks for your help. This is my first time using this site. What an amazing resource for math idiots like myself.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:56
$begingroup$
Sorry, now my last question: when you add b to both sides, how come .01763 becomes 1.1763, and not .01763b +b? Did I miss something there?
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:58
|
show 2 more comments
$begingroup$
Let's say your original 4 points are, going counterclockwise from the origin, $$(0,0),(100,0),(100,100),(0,100)$$
You want to rotate clockwise, which means the point that was on the origin will go up to $(0,a)$ and the point that was at $(0,100)$ will go to $(a,100)$. And if you draw out this new situation with all 4 little wedges filling in the space between your new square and the old, you can make triangles with a small leg of $a$ and a long leg of $b$ and you see that $a+b=100$.
So you have a system of two equations and two unknowns.
$$a+b=100\tan(10^{circ})=frac{a}{b}$$
This gives $aapprox14.99$. Your new 4 points will be
$$(0,14.99),(85.01,0),(100,85.01),(14.99,100)$$
Additionally, each side length was scaled by $0.8632$
EDIT: How to solve the system without a calculator solve() function.
- Find a numerical value of $tan(10^{circ})$. It is $0.1763$
- Solve the first equation in terms of $a$ so $a=100-b$
- Solve $0.1763=(100-b)/b$ or $0.1763b=100-b\1.1763b=100\b=100/1.1763\b=85.01$
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
Thank you for this. So forgive my ignorance, but how did you solve for a with those two equations? I have tan at .176, but how did you know a is 14.99. thanks again.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:46
$begingroup$
Ha, i used a calculator :). I'll edit my answer to show how to do it without a solver...
$endgroup$
– turkeyhundt
Jan 7 '15 at 23:47
$begingroup$
great, thank you, i appreciate it.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:50
$begingroup$
This is fantastic, thanks for your help. This is my first time using this site. What an amazing resource for math idiots like myself.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:56
$begingroup$
Sorry, now my last question: when you add b to both sides, how come .01763 becomes 1.1763, and not .01763b +b? Did I miss something there?
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:58
|
show 2 more comments
$begingroup$
Let's say your original 4 points are, going counterclockwise from the origin, $$(0,0),(100,0),(100,100),(0,100)$$
You want to rotate clockwise, which means the point that was on the origin will go up to $(0,a)$ and the point that was at $(0,100)$ will go to $(a,100)$. And if you draw out this new situation with all 4 little wedges filling in the space between your new square and the old, you can make triangles with a small leg of $a$ and a long leg of $b$ and you see that $a+b=100$.
So you have a system of two equations and two unknowns.
$$a+b=100\tan(10^{circ})=frac{a}{b}$$
This gives $aapprox14.99$. Your new 4 points will be
$$(0,14.99),(85.01,0),(100,85.01),(14.99,100)$$
Additionally, each side length was scaled by $0.8632$
EDIT: How to solve the system without a calculator solve() function.
- Find a numerical value of $tan(10^{circ})$. It is $0.1763$
- Solve the first equation in terms of $a$ so $a=100-b$
- Solve $0.1763=(100-b)/b$ or $0.1763b=100-b\1.1763b=100\b=100/1.1763\b=85.01$
$endgroup$
Let's say your original 4 points are, going counterclockwise from the origin, $$(0,0),(100,0),(100,100),(0,100)$$
You want to rotate clockwise, which means the point that was on the origin will go up to $(0,a)$ and the point that was at $(0,100)$ will go to $(a,100)$. And if you draw out this new situation with all 4 little wedges filling in the space between your new square and the old, you can make triangles with a small leg of $a$ and a long leg of $b$ and you see that $a+b=100$.
So you have a system of two equations and two unknowns.
$$a+b=100\tan(10^{circ})=frac{a}{b}$$
This gives $aapprox14.99$. Your new 4 points will be
$$(0,14.99),(85.01,0),(100,85.01),(14.99,100)$$
Additionally, each side length was scaled by $0.8632$
EDIT: How to solve the system without a calculator solve() function.
- Find a numerical value of $tan(10^{circ})$. It is $0.1763$
- Solve the first equation in terms of $a$ so $a=100-b$
- Solve $0.1763=(100-b)/b$ or $0.1763b=100-b\1.1763b=100\b=100/1.1763\b=85.01$
edited Jan 7 '15 at 23:51
answered Jan 7 '15 at 23:13
turkeyhundtturkeyhundt
6,85511025
6,85511025
$begingroup$
Thank you for this. So forgive my ignorance, but how did you solve for a with those two equations? I have tan at .176, but how did you know a is 14.99. thanks again.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:46
$begingroup$
Ha, i used a calculator :). I'll edit my answer to show how to do it without a solver...
$endgroup$
– turkeyhundt
Jan 7 '15 at 23:47
$begingroup$
great, thank you, i appreciate it.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:50
$begingroup$
This is fantastic, thanks for your help. This is my first time using this site. What an amazing resource for math idiots like myself.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:56
$begingroup$
Sorry, now my last question: when you add b to both sides, how come .01763 becomes 1.1763, and not .01763b +b? Did I miss something there?
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:58
|
show 2 more comments
$begingroup$
Thank you for this. So forgive my ignorance, but how did you solve for a with those two equations? I have tan at .176, but how did you know a is 14.99. thanks again.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:46
$begingroup$
Ha, i used a calculator :). I'll edit my answer to show how to do it without a solver...
$endgroup$
– turkeyhundt
Jan 7 '15 at 23:47
$begingroup$
great, thank you, i appreciate it.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:50
$begingroup$
This is fantastic, thanks for your help. This is my first time using this site. What an amazing resource for math idiots like myself.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:56
$begingroup$
Sorry, now my last question: when you add b to both sides, how come .01763 becomes 1.1763, and not .01763b +b? Did I miss something there?
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:58
$begingroup$
Thank you for this. So forgive my ignorance, but how did you solve for a with those two equations? I have tan at .176, but how did you know a is 14.99. thanks again.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:46
$begingroup$
Thank you for this. So forgive my ignorance, but how did you solve for a with those two equations? I have tan at .176, but how did you know a is 14.99. thanks again.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:46
$begingroup$
Ha, i used a calculator :). I'll edit my answer to show how to do it without a solver...
$endgroup$
– turkeyhundt
Jan 7 '15 at 23:47
$begingroup$
Ha, i used a calculator :). I'll edit my answer to show how to do it without a solver...
$endgroup$
– turkeyhundt
Jan 7 '15 at 23:47
$begingroup$
great, thank you, i appreciate it.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:50
$begingroup$
great, thank you, i appreciate it.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:50
$begingroup$
This is fantastic, thanks for your help. This is my first time using this site. What an amazing resource for math idiots like myself.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:56
$begingroup$
This is fantastic, thanks for your help. This is my first time using this site. What an amazing resource for math idiots like myself.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:56
$begingroup$
Sorry, now my last question: when you add b to both sides, how come .01763 becomes 1.1763, and not .01763b +b? Did I miss something there?
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:58
$begingroup$
Sorry, now my last question: when you add b to both sides, how come .01763 becomes 1.1763, and not .01763b +b? Did I miss something there?
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:58
|
show 2 more comments
$begingroup$
You have two correct answers already.
What I would like to do is to put the solution in terms that you can
very easily apply to your problem, that is, I want to give you a simple formula
to directly compute the coordinates of each vertex of each square.
Let's take polar coordinates with the origin at the center of the square, so that the large square in your diagram has vertices at
$(r_0,0)$, $left(r_0,fracpi2right)$, $(r_0,pi)$, $left(r_0,-fracpi2right)$
where $r_0$ is a positive constant determined by how large you want that square to be.
Now we rotate $delta$ radians to the right and shrink the square so that the new
square's vertices lie on the old square's edges.
(For a $10^circ$ rotation, you want $delta = frac{pi}{180} cdot 10.$)
Then the origin, one vertex of the original square, and the corresponding vertex of
the new square make a triangle with angle $delta$ at the origin, $fracpi4$ ($45^circ$)
at the original square's vertex, and $frac{3pi}{4}-delta$ at the new square's vertex.
Let $r_1$ be the distance from the origin to the new square's vertex.
By the law of sines,
$$ frac{r_1}{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}
= frac{r_0}{sin left(frac{3pi}{4}-deltaright)}.$$
Therefore
$$r_1 = frac{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}{sin left(frac{3pi}{4}-deltaright)} r_0
= frac{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}{sin left(frac{pi}{4}+deltaright)} r_0.$$
Let
$$rho = frac{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}{sin left(frac{pi}{4}+deltaright)}$$
so that $r_1 = rho, r_0.$
For an angle of $10^circ,$ a little computation shows that $rho approx 0.86321799,$
that is,
$$r_1 approx 0.86321799, r_0.$$
Checking this against the calculations by @turkeyhundt for the $10$-degree rotation,
we should find that $0.86321799 approx frac{sqrt{a^2+b^2}}{100},$
and indeed for $b = 85.01,$ $a=100-b$ that is what we find.
Now observe that in general, if $r_n$ is the distance from the origin to a vertex
of the $n$th square, then $r_{n+1} = rho, r_n.$
Also, if $alpha$ is the direction from the origin to a vertex of the $n$th square,
then the direction from the origin to a vertex of the $n+1$st square is
$alpha-delta$ (because polar coordinates measure angles counterclockwise
and we are rotating clockwise).
Putting these facts together, the vertices of the $n$th square
have polar coordinates
$$
(rho^n r_0,; -ndelta),\
left(rho^n r_0,; fracpi2-ndeltaright)!,\
(rho^n r_0,; pi-ndelta),\
left(rho^n r_0,; -fracpi2-ndeltaright)!.
$$
To plot these in Cartesian coordinates, convert the $(r,theta)$ coordinates
of each vertex of each square to $(x,y)$ coordinate by the usual
transformation, $x=rcostheta$ and $y=rsintheta.$
For example, one vertex of the $n$th square will have Cartesian coordinates
$(rho^n r_0 cos(-ndelta), rho^n r_0 sin(-ndelta)),$ and for the other
three you simply add a multiple of $fracpi2$ to the angle.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You have two correct answers already.
What I would like to do is to put the solution in terms that you can
very easily apply to your problem, that is, I want to give you a simple formula
to directly compute the coordinates of each vertex of each square.
Let's take polar coordinates with the origin at the center of the square, so that the large square in your diagram has vertices at
$(r_0,0)$, $left(r_0,fracpi2right)$, $(r_0,pi)$, $left(r_0,-fracpi2right)$
where $r_0$ is a positive constant determined by how large you want that square to be.
Now we rotate $delta$ radians to the right and shrink the square so that the new
square's vertices lie on the old square's edges.
(For a $10^circ$ rotation, you want $delta = frac{pi}{180} cdot 10.$)
Then the origin, one vertex of the original square, and the corresponding vertex of
the new square make a triangle with angle $delta$ at the origin, $fracpi4$ ($45^circ$)
at the original square's vertex, and $frac{3pi}{4}-delta$ at the new square's vertex.
Let $r_1$ be the distance from the origin to the new square's vertex.
By the law of sines,
$$ frac{r_1}{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}
= frac{r_0}{sin left(frac{3pi}{4}-deltaright)}.$$
Therefore
$$r_1 = frac{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}{sin left(frac{3pi}{4}-deltaright)} r_0
= frac{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}{sin left(frac{pi}{4}+deltaright)} r_0.$$
Let
$$rho = frac{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}{sin left(frac{pi}{4}+deltaright)}$$
so that $r_1 = rho, r_0.$
For an angle of $10^circ,$ a little computation shows that $rho approx 0.86321799,$
that is,
$$r_1 approx 0.86321799, r_0.$$
Checking this against the calculations by @turkeyhundt for the $10$-degree rotation,
we should find that $0.86321799 approx frac{sqrt{a^2+b^2}}{100},$
and indeed for $b = 85.01,$ $a=100-b$ that is what we find.
Now observe that in general, if $r_n$ is the distance from the origin to a vertex
of the $n$th square, then $r_{n+1} = rho, r_n.$
Also, if $alpha$ is the direction from the origin to a vertex of the $n$th square,
then the direction from the origin to a vertex of the $n+1$st square is
$alpha-delta$ (because polar coordinates measure angles counterclockwise
and we are rotating clockwise).
Putting these facts together, the vertices of the $n$th square
have polar coordinates
$$
(rho^n r_0,; -ndelta),\
left(rho^n r_0,; fracpi2-ndeltaright)!,\
(rho^n r_0,; pi-ndelta),\
left(rho^n r_0,; -fracpi2-ndeltaright)!.
$$
To plot these in Cartesian coordinates, convert the $(r,theta)$ coordinates
of each vertex of each square to $(x,y)$ coordinate by the usual
transformation, $x=rcostheta$ and $y=rsintheta.$
For example, one vertex of the $n$th square will have Cartesian coordinates
$(rho^n r_0 cos(-ndelta), rho^n r_0 sin(-ndelta)),$ and for the other
three you simply add a multiple of $fracpi2$ to the angle.
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
You have two correct answers already.
What I would like to do is to put the solution in terms that you can
very easily apply to your problem, that is, I want to give you a simple formula
to directly compute the coordinates of each vertex of each square.
Let's take polar coordinates with the origin at the center of the square, so that the large square in your diagram has vertices at
$(r_0,0)$, $left(r_0,fracpi2right)$, $(r_0,pi)$, $left(r_0,-fracpi2right)$
where $r_0$ is a positive constant determined by how large you want that square to be.
Now we rotate $delta$ radians to the right and shrink the square so that the new
square's vertices lie on the old square's edges.
(For a $10^circ$ rotation, you want $delta = frac{pi}{180} cdot 10.$)
Then the origin, one vertex of the original square, and the corresponding vertex of
the new square make a triangle with angle $delta$ at the origin, $fracpi4$ ($45^circ$)
at the original square's vertex, and $frac{3pi}{4}-delta$ at the new square's vertex.
Let $r_1$ be the distance from the origin to the new square's vertex.
By the law of sines,
$$ frac{r_1}{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}
= frac{r_0}{sin left(frac{3pi}{4}-deltaright)}.$$
Therefore
$$r_1 = frac{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}{sin left(frac{3pi}{4}-deltaright)} r_0
= frac{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}{sin left(frac{pi}{4}+deltaright)} r_0.$$
Let
$$rho = frac{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}{sin left(frac{pi}{4}+deltaright)}$$
so that $r_1 = rho, r_0.$
For an angle of $10^circ,$ a little computation shows that $rho approx 0.86321799,$
that is,
$$r_1 approx 0.86321799, r_0.$$
Checking this against the calculations by @turkeyhundt for the $10$-degree rotation,
we should find that $0.86321799 approx frac{sqrt{a^2+b^2}}{100},$
and indeed for $b = 85.01,$ $a=100-b$ that is what we find.
Now observe that in general, if $r_n$ is the distance from the origin to a vertex
of the $n$th square, then $r_{n+1} = rho, r_n.$
Also, if $alpha$ is the direction from the origin to a vertex of the $n$th square,
then the direction from the origin to a vertex of the $n+1$st square is
$alpha-delta$ (because polar coordinates measure angles counterclockwise
and we are rotating clockwise).
Putting these facts together, the vertices of the $n$th square
have polar coordinates
$$
(rho^n r_0,; -ndelta),\
left(rho^n r_0,; fracpi2-ndeltaright)!,\
(rho^n r_0,; pi-ndelta),\
left(rho^n r_0,; -fracpi2-ndeltaright)!.
$$
To plot these in Cartesian coordinates, convert the $(r,theta)$ coordinates
of each vertex of each square to $(x,y)$ coordinate by the usual
transformation, $x=rcostheta$ and $y=rsintheta.$
For example, one vertex of the $n$th square will have Cartesian coordinates
$(rho^n r_0 cos(-ndelta), rho^n r_0 sin(-ndelta)),$ and for the other
three you simply add a multiple of $fracpi2$ to the angle.
$endgroup$
You have two correct answers already.
What I would like to do is to put the solution in terms that you can
very easily apply to your problem, that is, I want to give you a simple formula
to directly compute the coordinates of each vertex of each square.
Let's take polar coordinates with the origin at the center of the square, so that the large square in your diagram has vertices at
$(r_0,0)$, $left(r_0,fracpi2right)$, $(r_0,pi)$, $left(r_0,-fracpi2right)$
where $r_0$ is a positive constant determined by how large you want that square to be.
Now we rotate $delta$ radians to the right and shrink the square so that the new
square's vertices lie on the old square's edges.
(For a $10^circ$ rotation, you want $delta = frac{pi}{180} cdot 10.$)
Then the origin, one vertex of the original square, and the corresponding vertex of
the new square make a triangle with angle $delta$ at the origin, $fracpi4$ ($45^circ$)
at the original square's vertex, and $frac{3pi}{4}-delta$ at the new square's vertex.
Let $r_1$ be the distance from the origin to the new square's vertex.
By the law of sines,
$$ frac{r_1}{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}
= frac{r_0}{sin left(frac{3pi}{4}-deltaright)}.$$
Therefore
$$r_1 = frac{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}{sin left(frac{3pi}{4}-deltaright)} r_0
= frac{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}{sin left(frac{pi}{4}+deltaright)} r_0.$$
Let
$$rho = frac{sin left(frac{pi}{4}right)}{sin left(frac{pi}{4}+deltaright)}$$
so that $r_1 = rho, r_0.$
For an angle of $10^circ,$ a little computation shows that $rho approx 0.86321799,$
that is,
$$r_1 approx 0.86321799, r_0.$$
Checking this against the calculations by @turkeyhundt for the $10$-degree rotation,
we should find that $0.86321799 approx frac{sqrt{a^2+b^2}}{100},$
and indeed for $b = 85.01,$ $a=100-b$ that is what we find.
Now observe that in general, if $r_n$ is the distance from the origin to a vertex
of the $n$th square, then $r_{n+1} = rho, r_n.$
Also, if $alpha$ is the direction from the origin to a vertex of the $n$th square,
then the direction from the origin to a vertex of the $n+1$st square is
$alpha-delta$ (because polar coordinates measure angles counterclockwise
and we are rotating clockwise).
Putting these facts together, the vertices of the $n$th square
have polar coordinates
$$
(rho^n r_0,; -ndelta),\
left(rho^n r_0,; fracpi2-ndeltaright)!,\
(rho^n r_0,; pi-ndelta),\
left(rho^n r_0,; -fracpi2-ndeltaright)!.
$$
To plot these in Cartesian coordinates, convert the $(r,theta)$ coordinates
of each vertex of each square to $(x,y)$ coordinate by the usual
transformation, $x=rcostheta$ and $y=rsintheta.$
For example, one vertex of the $n$th square will have Cartesian coordinates
$(rho^n r_0 cos(-ndelta), rho^n r_0 sin(-ndelta)),$ and for the other
three you simply add a multiple of $fracpi2$ to the angle.
edited Jan 10 '15 at 17:11
answered Jan 10 '15 at 15:35
David KDavid K
55.5k345121
55.5k345121
add a comment |
add a comment |
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$begingroup$
I've already drawn what I'm trying to achieve. what is the normal server used by users who want to upload their own images for this site? thanks.
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 22:57
$begingroup$
From what I can tell, you can choose to just add image and it will give you the option of uploading one from your own computer.
$endgroup$
– Johanna
Jan 7 '15 at 23:06
$begingroup$
yeah i found somewhere to upload it, thanks much
$endgroup$
– jb3330421
Jan 7 '15 at 23:18