Showing the Zariski topology is in fact a topology











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I have a definition of the closed sets of the Zariski topology that is :
A subset $V$ of $Bbb R^{n}$ is Zariski closed if there exists a set, $I$, consisting of polynomials in $n$ real variables such that



$V = { r in Bbb R^{n}| f(r)=0$ for all $f ∈ I }$ .



My first question is to wonder isn't any subset of $Bbb R^n$ Zariski closed using the zero polynomial?



Secondly, if I consider the open sets to be the complements of the sets of type $V$, I want to show that an arbitrary union of open sets is open. This amounts to showing , by DeMorgan's Law, that an arbitrary intersection of sets of type $V$ are closed, meaning for all the elements in the intersection, there has to be polynomials that evaluate to zero for these elements, which I am not sure how to show other than stating that the zero polynomial works, which seems too simple/wrong. Any hints appreciated.










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  • For the first question: using the $0$ polynomial is how you show $mathbb{R}^n$ is closed.
    – Ethan Bolker
    23 hours ago












  • @EthanBolker why would this not apply also to a subset?
    – IntegrateThis
    23 hours ago






  • 1




    Because (if you denote the right hand side as $Z(I)$) the requirement is that $V$ is exactly equal to $Z(I)$, not that $V subseteq Z(I)$.
    – Daniel Schepler
    23 hours ago










  • For the second question: suppose you have a family ${ I_lambda mid lambda in Lambda }$ of sets of polynomials - then what you want to show is that $bigcap_{lambda in Lambda} Z(I_lambda) = Z(bigcup_{lambda in Lambda} I_lambda)$.
    – Daniel Schepler
    23 hours ago










  • @DanielSchepler what is $Z(I)$
    – IntegrateThis
    23 hours ago















up vote
0
down vote

favorite












I have a definition of the closed sets of the Zariski topology that is :
A subset $V$ of $Bbb R^{n}$ is Zariski closed if there exists a set, $I$, consisting of polynomials in $n$ real variables such that



$V = { r in Bbb R^{n}| f(r)=0$ for all $f ∈ I }$ .



My first question is to wonder isn't any subset of $Bbb R^n$ Zariski closed using the zero polynomial?



Secondly, if I consider the open sets to be the complements of the sets of type $V$, I want to show that an arbitrary union of open sets is open. This amounts to showing , by DeMorgan's Law, that an arbitrary intersection of sets of type $V$ are closed, meaning for all the elements in the intersection, there has to be polynomials that evaluate to zero for these elements, which I am not sure how to show other than stating that the zero polynomial works, which seems too simple/wrong. Any hints appreciated.










share|cite|improve this question






















  • For the first question: using the $0$ polynomial is how you show $mathbb{R}^n$ is closed.
    – Ethan Bolker
    23 hours ago












  • @EthanBolker why would this not apply also to a subset?
    – IntegrateThis
    23 hours ago






  • 1




    Because (if you denote the right hand side as $Z(I)$) the requirement is that $V$ is exactly equal to $Z(I)$, not that $V subseteq Z(I)$.
    – Daniel Schepler
    23 hours ago










  • For the second question: suppose you have a family ${ I_lambda mid lambda in Lambda }$ of sets of polynomials - then what you want to show is that $bigcap_{lambda in Lambda} Z(I_lambda) = Z(bigcup_{lambda in Lambda} I_lambda)$.
    – Daniel Schepler
    23 hours ago










  • @DanielSchepler what is $Z(I)$
    – IntegrateThis
    23 hours ago













up vote
0
down vote

favorite









up vote
0
down vote

favorite











I have a definition of the closed sets of the Zariski topology that is :
A subset $V$ of $Bbb R^{n}$ is Zariski closed if there exists a set, $I$, consisting of polynomials in $n$ real variables such that



$V = { r in Bbb R^{n}| f(r)=0$ for all $f ∈ I }$ .



My first question is to wonder isn't any subset of $Bbb R^n$ Zariski closed using the zero polynomial?



Secondly, if I consider the open sets to be the complements of the sets of type $V$, I want to show that an arbitrary union of open sets is open. This amounts to showing , by DeMorgan's Law, that an arbitrary intersection of sets of type $V$ are closed, meaning for all the elements in the intersection, there has to be polynomials that evaluate to zero for these elements, which I am not sure how to show other than stating that the zero polynomial works, which seems too simple/wrong. Any hints appreciated.










share|cite|improve this question













I have a definition of the closed sets of the Zariski topology that is :
A subset $V$ of $Bbb R^{n}$ is Zariski closed if there exists a set, $I$, consisting of polynomials in $n$ real variables such that



$V = { r in Bbb R^{n}| f(r)=0$ for all $f ∈ I }$ .



My first question is to wonder isn't any subset of $Bbb R^n$ Zariski closed using the zero polynomial?



Secondly, if I consider the open sets to be the complements of the sets of type $V$, I want to show that an arbitrary union of open sets is open. This amounts to showing , by DeMorgan's Law, that an arbitrary intersection of sets of type $V$ are closed, meaning for all the elements in the intersection, there has to be polynomials that evaluate to zero for these elements, which I am not sure how to show other than stating that the zero polynomial works, which seems too simple/wrong. Any hints appreciated.







general-topology






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asked 23 hours ago









IntegrateThis

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  • For the first question: using the $0$ polynomial is how you show $mathbb{R}^n$ is closed.
    – Ethan Bolker
    23 hours ago












  • @EthanBolker why would this not apply also to a subset?
    – IntegrateThis
    23 hours ago






  • 1




    Because (if you denote the right hand side as $Z(I)$) the requirement is that $V$ is exactly equal to $Z(I)$, not that $V subseteq Z(I)$.
    – Daniel Schepler
    23 hours ago










  • For the second question: suppose you have a family ${ I_lambda mid lambda in Lambda }$ of sets of polynomials - then what you want to show is that $bigcap_{lambda in Lambda} Z(I_lambda) = Z(bigcup_{lambda in Lambda} I_lambda)$.
    – Daniel Schepler
    23 hours ago










  • @DanielSchepler what is $Z(I)$
    – IntegrateThis
    23 hours ago


















  • For the first question: using the $0$ polynomial is how you show $mathbb{R}^n$ is closed.
    – Ethan Bolker
    23 hours ago












  • @EthanBolker why would this not apply also to a subset?
    – IntegrateThis
    23 hours ago






  • 1




    Because (if you denote the right hand side as $Z(I)$) the requirement is that $V$ is exactly equal to $Z(I)$, not that $V subseteq Z(I)$.
    – Daniel Schepler
    23 hours ago










  • For the second question: suppose you have a family ${ I_lambda mid lambda in Lambda }$ of sets of polynomials - then what you want to show is that $bigcap_{lambda in Lambda} Z(I_lambda) = Z(bigcup_{lambda in Lambda} I_lambda)$.
    – Daniel Schepler
    23 hours ago










  • @DanielSchepler what is $Z(I)$
    – IntegrateThis
    23 hours ago
















For the first question: using the $0$ polynomial is how you show $mathbb{R}^n$ is closed.
– Ethan Bolker
23 hours ago






For the first question: using the $0$ polynomial is how you show $mathbb{R}^n$ is closed.
– Ethan Bolker
23 hours ago














@EthanBolker why would this not apply also to a subset?
– IntegrateThis
23 hours ago




@EthanBolker why would this not apply also to a subset?
– IntegrateThis
23 hours ago




1




1




Because (if you denote the right hand side as $Z(I)$) the requirement is that $V$ is exactly equal to $Z(I)$, not that $V subseteq Z(I)$.
– Daniel Schepler
23 hours ago




Because (if you denote the right hand side as $Z(I)$) the requirement is that $V$ is exactly equal to $Z(I)$, not that $V subseteq Z(I)$.
– Daniel Schepler
23 hours ago












For the second question: suppose you have a family ${ I_lambda mid lambda in Lambda }$ of sets of polynomials - then what you want to show is that $bigcap_{lambda in Lambda} Z(I_lambda) = Z(bigcup_{lambda in Lambda} I_lambda)$.
– Daniel Schepler
23 hours ago




For the second question: suppose you have a family ${ I_lambda mid lambda in Lambda }$ of sets of polynomials - then what you want to show is that $bigcap_{lambda in Lambda} Z(I_lambda) = Z(bigcup_{lambda in Lambda} I_lambda)$.
– Daniel Schepler
23 hours ago












@DanielSchepler what is $Z(I)$
– IntegrateThis
23 hours ago




@DanielSchepler what is $Z(I)$
– IntegrateThis
23 hours ago










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You show directly that the set of all $Z(I) = {x in mathbb{R}^n: forall f in I: f(x) = 0}$, where $I$ is any set of polynomials in $n$ variables, obeys the axioms for closed sets:



$emptyset$ is closed, because $emptyset = Z({1})$, where $1$ is the constant polynomial with value $1$ so there is no zero for it.



$mathbb{R}^n$ is closed, because $mathbb{R}^n = Z({0})$, with $0$ the constant polynomial with value $0$, so all $x$ are zeroes of it, trivially. We could also have used $mathbb{R}^n = Z(emptyset)$ if you like void truth.



If $Z(I), Z(J)$ are two closed sets (for finitely many it's enough to check the case of $2$ sets), then form $IJ = {fg: f in I, g in J}$, which is a well-defined set of $n$-dimensional polynomials on $mathbb{R}^n$. If $x in Z(I)$, $x$ vanishes for all $f in I$, so also for all $fg in IJ$. The same holds for $x in Z(J)$, so $Z(I) cup Z(J) subseteq Z(IJ)$. If $x notin z(I) cup Z(J)$ this means there is some $f in I$ such that $f(x) neq 0$ and some $g in J$ such that $g(x) neq 0$. It follows that $(fg)(x) neq 0$ and so $x notin Z(IJ)$. This shows



$$Z(IJ) = Z(I) cup Z(J)$$



so that the set of $Z(I)$ is closed under finite unions.



If $Z(I_alpha), alpha in A$ is any collection of such sets, then by the definitions it's clear that



$$bigcap_{alpha in A}Z(I_alpha) = Z(bigcup_{alpha in A} I_alpha)$$



and so this collection is closed under arbitrary intersections.



Now de Morgan or a standard theorem in elementary topology tells us that the complements of the sets of the form $Z(I)$ indeed form a topology on $mathbb{R}^n$. Note that the argument works for any commutative ring without zero-divisors (I used that for the finite unions).






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    You show directly that the set of all $Z(I) = {x in mathbb{R}^n: forall f in I: f(x) = 0}$, where $I$ is any set of polynomials in $n$ variables, obeys the axioms for closed sets:



    $emptyset$ is closed, because $emptyset = Z({1})$, where $1$ is the constant polynomial with value $1$ so there is no zero for it.



    $mathbb{R}^n$ is closed, because $mathbb{R}^n = Z({0})$, with $0$ the constant polynomial with value $0$, so all $x$ are zeroes of it, trivially. We could also have used $mathbb{R}^n = Z(emptyset)$ if you like void truth.



    If $Z(I), Z(J)$ are two closed sets (for finitely many it's enough to check the case of $2$ sets), then form $IJ = {fg: f in I, g in J}$, which is a well-defined set of $n$-dimensional polynomials on $mathbb{R}^n$. If $x in Z(I)$, $x$ vanishes for all $f in I$, so also for all $fg in IJ$. The same holds for $x in Z(J)$, so $Z(I) cup Z(J) subseteq Z(IJ)$. If $x notin z(I) cup Z(J)$ this means there is some $f in I$ such that $f(x) neq 0$ and some $g in J$ such that $g(x) neq 0$. It follows that $(fg)(x) neq 0$ and so $x notin Z(IJ)$. This shows



    $$Z(IJ) = Z(I) cup Z(J)$$



    so that the set of $Z(I)$ is closed under finite unions.



    If $Z(I_alpha), alpha in A$ is any collection of such sets, then by the definitions it's clear that



    $$bigcap_{alpha in A}Z(I_alpha) = Z(bigcup_{alpha in A} I_alpha)$$



    and so this collection is closed under arbitrary intersections.



    Now de Morgan or a standard theorem in elementary topology tells us that the complements of the sets of the form $Z(I)$ indeed form a topology on $mathbb{R}^n$. Note that the argument works for any commutative ring without zero-divisors (I used that for the finite unions).






    share|cite|improve this answer

























      up vote
      0
      down vote













      You show directly that the set of all $Z(I) = {x in mathbb{R}^n: forall f in I: f(x) = 0}$, where $I$ is any set of polynomials in $n$ variables, obeys the axioms for closed sets:



      $emptyset$ is closed, because $emptyset = Z({1})$, where $1$ is the constant polynomial with value $1$ so there is no zero for it.



      $mathbb{R}^n$ is closed, because $mathbb{R}^n = Z({0})$, with $0$ the constant polynomial with value $0$, so all $x$ are zeroes of it, trivially. We could also have used $mathbb{R}^n = Z(emptyset)$ if you like void truth.



      If $Z(I), Z(J)$ are two closed sets (for finitely many it's enough to check the case of $2$ sets), then form $IJ = {fg: f in I, g in J}$, which is a well-defined set of $n$-dimensional polynomials on $mathbb{R}^n$. If $x in Z(I)$, $x$ vanishes for all $f in I$, so also for all $fg in IJ$. The same holds for $x in Z(J)$, so $Z(I) cup Z(J) subseteq Z(IJ)$. If $x notin z(I) cup Z(J)$ this means there is some $f in I$ such that $f(x) neq 0$ and some $g in J$ such that $g(x) neq 0$. It follows that $(fg)(x) neq 0$ and so $x notin Z(IJ)$. This shows



      $$Z(IJ) = Z(I) cup Z(J)$$



      so that the set of $Z(I)$ is closed under finite unions.



      If $Z(I_alpha), alpha in A$ is any collection of such sets, then by the definitions it's clear that



      $$bigcap_{alpha in A}Z(I_alpha) = Z(bigcup_{alpha in A} I_alpha)$$



      and so this collection is closed under arbitrary intersections.



      Now de Morgan or a standard theorem in elementary topology tells us that the complements of the sets of the form $Z(I)$ indeed form a topology on $mathbb{R}^n$. Note that the argument works for any commutative ring without zero-divisors (I used that for the finite unions).






      share|cite|improve this answer























        up vote
        0
        down vote










        up vote
        0
        down vote









        You show directly that the set of all $Z(I) = {x in mathbb{R}^n: forall f in I: f(x) = 0}$, where $I$ is any set of polynomials in $n$ variables, obeys the axioms for closed sets:



        $emptyset$ is closed, because $emptyset = Z({1})$, where $1$ is the constant polynomial with value $1$ so there is no zero for it.



        $mathbb{R}^n$ is closed, because $mathbb{R}^n = Z({0})$, with $0$ the constant polynomial with value $0$, so all $x$ are zeroes of it, trivially. We could also have used $mathbb{R}^n = Z(emptyset)$ if you like void truth.



        If $Z(I), Z(J)$ are two closed sets (for finitely many it's enough to check the case of $2$ sets), then form $IJ = {fg: f in I, g in J}$, which is a well-defined set of $n$-dimensional polynomials on $mathbb{R}^n$. If $x in Z(I)$, $x$ vanishes for all $f in I$, so also for all $fg in IJ$. The same holds for $x in Z(J)$, so $Z(I) cup Z(J) subseteq Z(IJ)$. If $x notin z(I) cup Z(J)$ this means there is some $f in I$ such that $f(x) neq 0$ and some $g in J$ such that $g(x) neq 0$. It follows that $(fg)(x) neq 0$ and so $x notin Z(IJ)$. This shows



        $$Z(IJ) = Z(I) cup Z(J)$$



        so that the set of $Z(I)$ is closed under finite unions.



        If $Z(I_alpha), alpha in A$ is any collection of such sets, then by the definitions it's clear that



        $$bigcap_{alpha in A}Z(I_alpha) = Z(bigcup_{alpha in A} I_alpha)$$



        and so this collection is closed under arbitrary intersections.



        Now de Morgan or a standard theorem in elementary topology tells us that the complements of the sets of the form $Z(I)$ indeed form a topology on $mathbb{R}^n$. Note that the argument works for any commutative ring without zero-divisors (I used that for the finite unions).






        share|cite|improve this answer












        You show directly that the set of all $Z(I) = {x in mathbb{R}^n: forall f in I: f(x) = 0}$, where $I$ is any set of polynomials in $n$ variables, obeys the axioms for closed sets:



        $emptyset$ is closed, because $emptyset = Z({1})$, where $1$ is the constant polynomial with value $1$ so there is no zero for it.



        $mathbb{R}^n$ is closed, because $mathbb{R}^n = Z({0})$, with $0$ the constant polynomial with value $0$, so all $x$ are zeroes of it, trivially. We could also have used $mathbb{R}^n = Z(emptyset)$ if you like void truth.



        If $Z(I), Z(J)$ are two closed sets (for finitely many it's enough to check the case of $2$ sets), then form $IJ = {fg: f in I, g in J}$, which is a well-defined set of $n$-dimensional polynomials on $mathbb{R}^n$. If $x in Z(I)$, $x$ vanishes for all $f in I$, so also for all $fg in IJ$. The same holds for $x in Z(J)$, so $Z(I) cup Z(J) subseteq Z(IJ)$. If $x notin z(I) cup Z(J)$ this means there is some $f in I$ such that $f(x) neq 0$ and some $g in J$ such that $g(x) neq 0$. It follows that $(fg)(x) neq 0$ and so $x notin Z(IJ)$. This shows



        $$Z(IJ) = Z(I) cup Z(J)$$



        so that the set of $Z(I)$ is closed under finite unions.



        If $Z(I_alpha), alpha in A$ is any collection of such sets, then by the definitions it's clear that



        $$bigcap_{alpha in A}Z(I_alpha) = Z(bigcup_{alpha in A} I_alpha)$$



        and so this collection is closed under arbitrary intersections.



        Now de Morgan or a standard theorem in elementary topology tells us that the complements of the sets of the form $Z(I)$ indeed form a topology on $mathbb{R}^n$. Note that the argument works for any commutative ring without zero-divisors (I used that for the finite unions).







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        answered 17 hours ago









        Henno Brandsma

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